What is your Twin Peaks unpopular opinion?

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mtwentz
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Re: What is your Twin Peaks unpopular opinion?

Post by mtwentz »

LateReg wrote: Tue Jun 15, 2021 1:22 pm Thirded, in general. But also, in the sense that even if I don't find the latter half of Season 1 to be the weakest portion of the show (and it has some of my favorite moments, for sure, including Log Lady's cabin with the music playing and the stuff with Maddie by the Gazebo and Jacques in One Eyed Jacks), I do find it to be the most typically TV-like, as well-oiled as it is. I've said a few times that I find the first third of Season 2 to be the best stretch of the original series, even if I find that it lulls slightly.
That segues into my unpopular opinion number one- yeah, not a big fan of the 2nd half of Season 1. It's sort of 'blah' to me. I did not become a Peaks Freak until Lynch threw that all out the door with episode 8.

Unpopular opinion number 2: I am now officially glad that Ontkean did not appear in S3. I really enjoy Forster's performance.
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Re: What is your Twin Peaks unpopular opinion?

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I like Episode 22 :-)

Actually, I'd be happy to go and watch it right now. Then again, it's not what I logged in for, after a few years...
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mtwentz
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Re: What is your Twin Peaks unpopular opinion?

Post by mtwentz »

BOB1 wrote: Sat Jul 03, 2021 3:35 pm I like Episode 22 :-)

Actually, I'd be happy to go and watch it right now. Then again, it's not what I logged in for, after a few years...
Hey Bob1, welcome back! I think it has been ages...
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Re: What is your Twin Peaks unpopular opinion?

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Bah! It's been ages since I watched Episode 22 as well!

Can't say I'm much of a Twin Peaks watcher these days :-(
But I believe it's just a temporary condition.
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JackwithOneEye
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Re: What is your Twin Peaks unpopular opinion?

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mtwentz wrote: Wed Jun 30, 2021 11:43 am
LateReg wrote: Tue Jun 15, 2021 1:22 pm Thirded, in general. But also, in the sense that even if I don't find the latter half of Season 1 to be the weakest portion of the show (and it has some of my favorite moments, for sure, including Log Lady's cabin with the music playing and the stuff with Maddie by the Gazebo and Jacques in One Eyed Jacks), I do find it to be the most typically TV-like, as well-oiled as it is. I've said a few times that I find the first third of Season 2 to be the best stretch of the original series, even if I find that it lulls slightly.
That segues into my unpopular opinion number one- yeah, not a big fan of the 2nd half of Season 1. It's sort of 'blah' to me. I did not become a Peaks Freak until Lynch threw that all out the door with episode 8.

Unpopular opinion number 2: I am now officially glad that Ontkean did not appear in S3. I really enjoy Forster's performance.
II agree with a lot of this. I remember watching the Pilot in 1990 and being utterly astonished it was made for TV, like Blue Velvet had somehow arrived on ABC. and then I felt in the weeks after, a lo of season 1 felt to me like just Dallas/Dynasty primetime soap stuff with love triangles and arson plots, but a bit quirky, and helped out by Angelo's music cues. The season 2 premiere though really blew me away.

It wasn't as realist as the pilot, the scenes with the giant and Ronette's visions of Bob of course, rather fantastical. But so many dramatic sequences from Lynch the way he directed, paced, composed the frame, Garland's dream, Leland's singing fits, the steamed pig burning with the ledgers conversation, Ben and Jerry circling Hank, Big Ed's story of Nadine's eye, the bad hospital food as a linking thread etc. made it so unique. What could have been casually directed, he really brought a lot of spark and ingenuity to it. That's one of my favorite episodes.
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Re: What is your Twin Peaks unpopular opinion?

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JackwithOneEye wrote: Sat Jul 03, 2021 4:51 pm It wasn't as realist as the pilot, the scenes with the giant and Ronette's visions of Bob of course, rather fantastical. But so many dramatic sequences from Lynch the way he directed, paced, composed the frame, Garland's dream, Leland's singing fits, the steamed pig burning with the ledgers conversation, Ben and Jerry circling Hank, Big Ed's story of Nadine's eye, the bad hospital food as a linking thread etc. made it so unique. What could have been casually directed, he really brought a lot of spark and ingenuity to it. That's one of my favorite episodes.
Co-sign. One very minor scene that always struck me from that episode, and seems like it adds to your point, is when Norma is in the hospital and she sees Ed with Nadine. She has moments of facial acting in S1 that express she has emotions she's guarding, but she never feels as potent, plaintive and sympathetic as she does there. The emotion of that moment is really sensitively drawn out.
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Re: What is your Twin Peaks unpopular opinion?

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True that. However, anything we say about how brilliant Episode 8 is, can hardly be considered an unpopular Twin Peaks opinion ;-)

So let me put forward one, which may perhaps qualify: altough I think my most favourite episode is said number 8 - if there is any other one which may compete, it will be the non-Lynch episode 16. The finale (mainly: Leland in prison, the interrogation, the confession...) is just slightly inferior to Twin Peaks' best moment ever (being the Ep.14 finale, clearly) but as a whole I find Ep.16 more coherent and perfect (than 14). Episode 8 seems to me the best as a whole but then there is no highlight as strong as Leland's confession.
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Re: What is your Twin Peaks unpopular opinion?

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AXX°N N. wrote: Sun Jul 04, 2021 11:23 am
JackwithOneEye wrote: Sat Jul 03, 2021 4:51 pm It wasn't as realist as the pilot, the scenes with the giant and Ronette's visions of Bob of course, rather fantastical. But so many dramatic sequences from Lynch the way he directed, paced, composed the frame, Garland's dream, Leland's singing fits, the steamed pig burning with the ledgers conversation, Ben and Jerry circling Hank, Big Ed's story of Nadine's eye, the bad hospital food as a linking thread etc. made it so unique. What could have been casually directed, he really brought a lot of spark and ingenuity to it. That's one of my favorite episodes.
Co-sign. One very minor scene that always struck me from that episode, and seems like it adds to your point, is when Norma is in the hospital and she sees Ed with Nadine. She has moments of facial acting in S1 that express she has emotions she's guarding, but she never feels as potent, plaintive and sympathetic as she does there. The emotion of that moment is really sensitively drawn out.
Yeah, I love that bit where Norma looks on at Ed and Nadine. Also, the lingering long take after Cooper/Albert/Truman leave the frame in the hospital and the doctor goes to the nurses station to talk about how bad the hospital food is.
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Re: What is your Twin Peaks unpopular opinion?

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ep 16 is one of my least favorite episodes.

I don't like angles at the start. compositions look like something out of 1960's Batman, seemed to be trying too hard.

the Roadhouse gathering of suspects seemed like bad TV, and a far cry from how stunning the pilot was, that it was becoming like a Tales from the Crypt type deal.
(though I do kinda like the Giant being symbolism for intuition/ instinct)

also, I hate that the way Leland is tricked, is that he's gonna be Ben Horne's attorney defending him for murdering his own daughter. I like dreamy and can suspend disbelief with a lot of stuff, but that was insultingly dumb.

the one scene I really like in that episode is the diary pages and the revelation Cooper and Laura had the same dream. And that Mrs. Tremont possibly wasn't real. That was interesting.
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Re: What is your Twin Peaks unpopular opinion?

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Episode 16 must be one of the most divisive episodes, for sure, which I was never aware of until joining Dugpa. So its definitely an interesting one to bring up in the unpopular opinion thread! It's the only episode I can think of that is as likely to finish high in someone's top ten episodes as it is for someone to call it one of their least favorites due to certain narrative decisions, pacing, etc.
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Re: What is your Twin Peaks unpopular opinion?

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LateReg wrote: Mon Jul 05, 2021 8:55 pm It's the only episode I can think of that is as likely to finish high in someone's top ten episodes as it is for someone to call it one of their least favorites due to certain narrative decisions, pacing, etc.
True that. Me and my viewing partner both disliked it on our first watch together. But then on a rewatch before the Return we both appreciated it much more. It can be divisive even to individuals!
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Re: What is your Twin Peaks unpopular opinion?

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I never knew 16 was that divisive either - though having read people's negative comments on it, I kind of agree with them even if I still think it's okay or one of the better non-Lynch ones.

I find a lot of stuff I watched pre-internet has a reputation online - a general consensus, if you will - that I wasn't aware of at all. I usually end up agreeing somewhat with people's views if they're making good points and not just ripping something apart with no basis, but if I'd already really liked it, it rarely changes my overall view - it just becomes something interesting to note "oh, this movie or this episode is considered subpar". Recently found even episodes of Frasier have a certain consensus among fans and some are viewed very negatively (not even the later ones, but some of the earlier classic ones) and some of those surprised me. So every fandom seems to have it. It's interesting to wonder if these things would still have these general viewpoints if the internet didn't exist - or would we just be going on personal tastes, what our friends liked, and what the critics said. Did these general consensuses only begin to form after the internet? I know certain movies have been considered classics or duds long before, but how did people ever discuss them in a more widespread manner, or were these things mainly being decided by the critics and for the last 20 or so years they're being decided more by general audiences and discussion boards?
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Re: What is your Twin Peaks unpopular opinion?

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Jonah wrote: Tue Jul 06, 2021 9:14 am I never knew 16 was that divisive either - though having read people's negative comments on it, I kind of agree with them even if I still think it's okay or one of the better non-Lynch ones.

I find a lot of stuff I watched pre-internet has a reputation online - a general consensus, if you will - that I wasn't aware of at all. I usually end up agreeing somewhat with people's views if they're making good points and not just ripping something apart with no basis, but if I'd already really liked it, it rarely changes my overall view - it just becomes something interesting to note "oh, this movie or this episode is considered subpar". Recently found even episodes of Frasier have a certain consensus among fans and some are viewed very negatively (not even the later ones, but some of the earlier classic ones) and some of those surprised me. So every fandom seems to have it. It's interesting to wonder if these things would still have these general viewpoints if the internet didn't exist - or would we just be going on personal tastes, what our friends liked, and what the critics said. Did these general consensuses only begin to form after the internet? I know certain movies have been considered classics or duds long before, but how did people ever discuss them in a more widespread manner, or were these things mainly being decided by the critics and for the last 20 or so years they're being decided more by general audiences and discussion boards?
This is right up my alley, but I sadly don't have the energy to discuss. But I think that even though you've worded those as questions, they pretty much double as POINTS, and they are damn fine points! Great things to think about.

The one thing I will say just because it's the easiest thing to say is that I hate the echo chamber of the internet. There's so many more interesting pockets to fall into--both obscure and aggregated (Rotten Tomatoes and the like are great if you dig deep within them)--and yet unless you fall into one of those pockets, the echo chamber is so strong that that's all there is. Everyone is so divided in their viewing nowadays with so many options that it's important to know where to look, but a lot of folks don't really even look, and then they just fall prey to the most bland echo chamber imaginable. In that way, it's perhaps not much different than the pre-internet days.
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JackwithOneEye
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Re: What is your Twin Peaks unpopular opinion?

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pre internet days, I used to seek out Siskel & Ebert if I wanted to hear someone's opinion. and there were local critics who appeared on the news. EWeekly used to have capsules and they would tabulate what people like Peter Travers thought in a chart, so you didnt have to neceessarily seek out a Rolling Stone issue yourself. I guess Entertainment Weekly was the first rotten tomatoes.

problem with S & E and film criticism at large in the 1980's is it got viewed as consumer advocacy, like does this car have good gas mileage or is it overpriced. and putting art into a consumer reports grinder like that could be frustrating.
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Re: What is your Twin Peaks unpopular opinion?

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I used to read Time Out film reviews and buy their annual book of reviews - seems strange now when you can just Google a film but having one of them on hand was essential to me to look up films and read their tiny paragraph-review in the book. Empire Magaizine was also a popular source for reviews. I didn't have access to any of the stuff you mentioned as wasn't in the US. I only really became aware of those sources, ironically, online and much later on.
I have no idea where this will lead us, but I have a definite feeling it will be a place both wonderful and strange.
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