Season 4? Or is it over after this? Wisteria/Unrecorded Night? Something else? (Speculation thread.)

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mtwentz
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Re: Season 4? Or is it over after this? Wisteria/Unrecorded Night? Something else? (Speculation thread.)

Post by mtwentz »

4 years ago we got an ending and even today we are still debating the ending's 'meaning' :-)
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Re: Season 4? Or is it over after this? Wisteria/Unrecorded Night? Something else? (Speculation thread.)

Post by Mordeen »

Audrey Horne wrote: Wed Sep 01, 2021 1:03 pm “grow the hell up, seriously.”

We’re addicted to and debating. a soap opera off the air thirty years about a dancing dwarf and talking logs. Sad to say, I think that lifeboat for most of us sailed away long ago.
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Re: Season 4? Or is it over after this? Wisteria/Unrecorded Night? Something else? (Speculation thread.)

Post by NormoftheAndes »

Mordeen wrote: Fri Sep 03, 2021 9:45 pm
Audrey Horne wrote: Wed Sep 01, 2021 1:03 pm “grow the hell up, seriously.”

We’re addicted to and debating. a soap opera off the air thirty years about a dancing dwarf and talking logs. Sad to say, I think that lifeboat for most of us sailed away long ago.
You just won teh interwebs.

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Sorry, can you explain to me what is meant by Twin Peaks being a 'lifeboat' please? :?
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Re: Season 4? Or is it over after this? Wisteria/Unrecorded Night? Something else? (Speculation thread.)

Post by Jasper »

mtwentz wrote: Wed Sep 01, 2021 3:35 pm I loved the LMFAP workaround for S3. Pretty cool stuff.

The Jeffries teapot did not work for me. I would rather have had them put another actor in there.
I half agree. I actually love the "teapot," its machine noises and steam writing. I just don't like it as a Bowie replacement.

A few months ago Krishnanspace mentioned Raymond Thiry, the actor pictured below. He might have really worked. Imagine Cooper and Mr. C when they go into the creepy motel room. It’s very dark and shadowy, and Jeffries (played by Raymond Thiry) is sitting totally still in a chair on the other side of the room, shadows falling across his face, and he's smoking, keeping some of that teapot ambiance. Just give him some bleached Bowie hair, slick Bowie clothes, one mismatched contact lens, and leave the rest to his acting chops.
krishnanspace wrote: Sat Jun 05, 2021 7:57 am I’m currently watching a Dutch show called Undercover and if they wanna cast Philip Jeffries they should cast Raymond Thiry.
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He actually looks like a mix between Ray Wise and David Bowie
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Re: Season 4? Or is it over after this? Wisteria/Unrecorded Night? Something else? (Speculation thread.)

Post by Rainwater »

Jasper wrote: Sun Sep 05, 2021 12:24 am
mtwentz wrote: Wed Sep 01, 2021 3:35 pm I loved the LMFAP workaround for S3. Pretty cool stuff.

The Jeffries teapot did not work for me. I would rather have had them put another actor in there.
I half agree. I actually love the "teapot," its machine noises and steam writing. I just don't like it as a Bowie replacement.

Krishnanspace mentioned this actor a few months ago. He might have really worked. Imagine Cooper and Mr. C when they go into the creepy motel room. It’s very dark and shadowy, and Jeffries (played by this actor) is sitting in a chair totally still on the other side of the room, shadows falling across his face, and he's smoking, keeping some of that teapot ambiance. Just give him some bleached Bowie hair, slick Bowie clothes, one mismatched contact lens, and leave the rest to his acting chops.
krishnanspace wrote: Sat Jun 05, 2021 7:57 am I’m currently watching a Dutch show called Undercover and if they wanna cast Philip Jeffries they should cast Raymond Thiry.
Image

He actually looks like a mix between Ray Wise and David Bowie
He could totally do it as far as looks go. I don't know how people feel about this, but to me, an older Phillip Jeffries doesn't necessarily have to look like an old Bowie - like, I can distinguish between the character and the actor, in the sense that you can imagine an older version of the Jeffries we've seen, and he doesn't necessarily need to look like Bowie actually did in his old age. The voice, though. The odds that this guy could mimic that are pretty slim. The voice actually bothered me in TR, not in the new scenes, but in the FWWM flashback - I don't know why in the world they had to dub that. It's not that it's not a good Jeffries voice - it's pretty great. But It's always really jarring because I remember what he's "meant" to sound like in the scene.

All that being said, I really don't like the idea of recasting iconic characters if it can be helped. I liked the steam machine, I think it was a great solution, although just like the Tree, it will always be a "what if" - would it have been better if it went as originally planned, or did the changes actually enrich the material? It would've been awesome to get Bowie, and probably the Little Man too (all BTS drama aside) - but who knows. Maybe the absence of one or both ended up elevating it somehow. I guess this is an old conversation.
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Re: Season 4? Or is it over after this? Wisteria/Unrecorded Night? Something else? (Speculation thread.)

Post by eyeboogers »

When Bowie was asked to be in The Return, he both declined (for obvious reasons) and also requested that his FWWM dialogue not be used - although he didn't mind the flashback as images. Someone had made him feel self conscious about the slightly exaggerated southern accent he'd chosen for FWWM. It is unlikely that Bowie could have blocked the use of the original dialogue legally, so it was probably more of a courtesy that it was done. The great thing about Jeffries having become the steaming tea pot, is that it shows us exactly what is likely to happen to Cooper after a few more trips through the loop. That sense of Coop having intensely (and unless there is a sequel, irrevocably) lost his way, wouldn't have worked as well if Bowie had just looked a bit gloomy in a hotel room. So it's a win some-lose some that it ended up like this.
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Re: Season 4? Or is it over after this? Wisteria/Unrecorded Night? Something else? (Speculation thread.)

Post by JackwithOneEye »

I agree with you eyeboogers. I got the sense that if you travel too much back and forth in the chambers of the lodge and not attain peace/nirvana, you lose your identity, you lose yourself, and Jeffries has maybe run out of chances, and has become more of an idea/ abstraction at this point. I was happy that they didn't do a re-cast.
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Re: Season 4? Or is it over after this? Wisteria/Unrecorded Night? Something else? (Speculation thread.)

Post by Stavrogyn »

I was hoping that Bowie would actually appear, even though he wasn't on that list, and that they're keeping it as a surprise.

I'm still a bit mixed regarding the final result, but I definitely enjoy it; I think those scenes are very atmospheric and memorable.

The Evolution of the Arm was perfect.
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Re: Season 4? Or is it over after this? Wisteria/Unrecorded Night? Something else? (Speculation thread.)

Post by Jasper »

Rainwater wrote: Sun Sep 05, 2021 1:25 am
He could totally do it as far as looks go. I don't know how people feel about this, but to me, an older Phillip Jeffries doesn't necessarily have to look like an old Bowie - like, I can distinguish between the character and the actor, in the sense that you can imagine an older version of the Jeffries we've seen, and he doesn't necessarily need to look like Bowie actually did in his old age. The voice, though. The odds that this guy could mimic that are pretty slim. The voice actually bothered me in TR, not in the new scenes, but in the FWWM flashback - I don't know why in the world they had to dub that. It's not that it's not a good Jeffries voice - it's pretty great. But It's always really jarring because I remember what he's "meant" to sound like in the scene.

All that being said, I really don't like the idea of recasting iconic characters if it can be helped. I liked the steam machine, I think it was a great solution, although just like the Tree, it will always be a "what if" - would it have been better if it went as originally planned, or did the changes actually enrich the material? It would've been awesome to get Bowie, and probably the Little Man too (all BTS drama aside) - but who knows. Maybe the absence of one or both ended up elevating it somehow. I guess this is an old conversation.
I hear what you’re saying about recasts. I agree with that the vast majority of the time, and I was relieved that Harry Truman wasn’t recast in the Return. Moira Kelly did a great job in FWWM, though naturally you hope that such a recast doesn’t have to happen, that one ended up being unavoidable.
I understand not wanting a recast, but it’s just that looking at Raymond Thiry, it seems almost like the universe is offering you something to help you out with your Bowie acting absence.
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The actor’s voice would be fine, but he’s Dutch and I don’t even know how good his English might be, so that could definitely be an issue.

As was mentioned, Bowie didn’t want his own voice used in the Return. I think that’s too bad, because his appearance in FWWM is perfect. It’s one of the most electrifying things in all of Twin Peaks. On the other hand, they’d have needed a different voice anyway to do the “teapot” scenes, though they could have made that sound more like Bowie in FWWM.

I just think it would be really cool to go in there for the Jeffries reveal and see, more or less Jeffries. I had a very faint hope that it could happen with Bowie. I’d imagine that he’d be basically be a permanent full time resident of that motel room.
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Re: Season 4? Or is it over after this? Wisteria/Unrecorded Night? Something else? (Speculation thread.)

Post by Pinky »

JackwithOneEye wrote: Sun Sep 05, 2021 8:24 am I agree with you eyeboogers. I got the sense that if you travel too much back and forth in the chambers of the lodge and not attain peace/nirvana, you lose your identity, you lose yourself, and Jeffries has maybe run out of chances, and has become more of an idea/ abstraction at this point. I was happy that they didn't do a re-cast.
on the plus side, though, he seems to have carved out quite the niche for himself, with a place at The Dutchman's and the ability to move time!
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Re: Season 4? Or is it over after this? Wisteria/Unrecorded Night? Something else? (Speculation thread.)

Post by JackwithOneEye »

Pinky wrote: Sun Sep 05, 2021 12:59 pm
JackwithOneEye wrote: Sun Sep 05, 2021 8:24 am I agree with you eyeboogers. I got the sense that if you travel too much back and forth in the chambers of the lodge and not attain peace/nirvana, you lose your identity, you lose yourself, and Jeffries has maybe run out of chances, and has become more of an idea/ abstraction at this point. I was happy that they didn't do a re-cast.
on the plus side, though, he seems to have carved out quite the niche for himself, with a place at The Dutchman's and the ability to move time!
yeah, Jeffies is a bit like an oracle out of greek mythology - pythia at delphi etc, the guardian in star trek - city on the edge of forever, or the weird sisters in Macbeth. it seems like they're all damaged in some way and function to give prophecies and knowledge mostly, but their time for personal ambition has come and gone.
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Re: Season 4? Or is it over after this? Wisteria/Unrecorded Night? Something else? (Speculation thread.)

Post by Jasper »

There was something about Lynch sketching the "teapot" and drawing Bowie's face in the steam. I wonder if he was thinking of some kind of solution like that. Sort of like this:



Also, sort of related:



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Re: Season 4? Or is it over after this? Wisteria/Unrecorded Night? Something else? (Speculation thread.)

Post by krishnanspace »

That actor did speak English in the show but with an accent. I mean originally the plan was to have Bowie play Jeffries physically so I don’t see any negatives to Raymond playing Jeffries in the future
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Re: Season 4? Or is it over after this? Wisteria/Unrecorded Night? Something else? (Speculation thread.)

Post by Jasper »

krishnanspace wrote: Wed Sep 08, 2021 10:17 am That actor did speak English in the show but with an accent. I mean originally the plan was to have Bowie play Jeffries physically so I don’t see any negatives to Raymond playing Jeffries in the future
Yes, as far as we know, Coop and Laura could run into Jeffries somewhere in space and time(line). Once Jeffries is canned, does it mean that he's always in the machine and nobody might ever see him out and about? What about retroactively? Could Coop and Laura end up in Argentina? There are definitely some loose ends in Argentina that they could use to go in and create a thousand more loose ends. :lol:

As for Raymond Thiry's accent, actors are sometimes very good at adopting other accents, though there's now precedent for Jeffries being dubbed/voiced by another actor. In the long shot scenario where this issue arises, the creators could elect to have the voice dubbed by the same actor who's already voiced Jeffries.

All of this is, of course, way out speculation. We're just dreaming of various possibilities. Here in the potential season 4 thread we really do live inside a dream.
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Re: Season 4? Or is it over after this? Wisteria/Unrecorded Night? Something else? (Speculation thread.)

Post by Soolsma »

Raymond Thiry is Dutch, just like Carel Struyken ;), whose accent is also quite apparent (at least for us Dutchies). I've seen Thiry perform in a bunch of Dutch/Belgian shows and he indeed has a knack for doing a variety of Dutch accents. Though I can't recall him speaking English, most Dutch people speak English as a second language.
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