World of Blue - Archived Forum 2007-2022

Not sure part 18 is so much set in 'reality', the dead body sitting in the living room, the way Cooper just accepts it, still feels rather dream-like.

I think it's possible DL had a lot of these images in his head and he just wanted to translate it to the moving image without it being
filtered too much, and just staying true to the idea..

JackwithOneEye wrote: ↑Wed Dec 01, 2021 9:02 pm Not sure part 18 is so much set in 'reality', the dead body sitting in the living room, the way Cooper just accepts it, still feels rather dream-like.

I think it's possible DL had a lot of these images in his head and he just wanted to translate it to the moving image without it being
filtered too much, and just staying true to the idea..

Well, actually, how many times does law enforcement look the other way when a crime is committed in the real world?

I think it happens often when the person they are seeking is some type of informant. So although I found it a bit weird, if you assume Cooper is mission driven, that he has to get Laura/Carrie to the Palmer house, it's not that weird that he doesn't respond to the dead body. Really, he has no time for it.

What's really weird is that Carrie would invite law enforcement in the house with a dead body in the living room.

I was just saying the scene was dream-like and I'm unsure about the comparison to the final bit in Mulholland. I agree with your larger point, that Cooper has other things on his mind, and mission driven. I get that. I get it that cops and FBI look the other way when there's bigger fish to fry.

I just dunno if I go with all 30 original eps/17 new eps were the dream, and this is 'reality'. He remembers Laura Palmer really well, her parents names, where Twin Peaks is. Dreams tend to recede a bit after a few hours.

mtwentz wrote: ↑Thu Dec 02, 2021 10:13 am

JackwithOneEye wrote: ↑Wed Dec 01, 2021 9:02 pm Not sure part 18 is so much set in 'reality', the dead body sitting in the living room, the way Cooper just accepts it, still feels rather dream-like.

I think it's possible DL had a lot of these images in his head and he just wanted to translate it to the moving image without it being
filtered too much, and just staying true to the idea..

Well, actually, how many times does law enforcement look the other way when a crime is committed in the real world?

I think it happens often when the person they are seeking is some type of informant. So although I found it a bit weird, if you assume Cooper is mission driven, that he has to get Laura/Carrie to the Palmer house, it's not that weird.

What's really weird is that Carrie would invite law enforcement in the house with a dead body in the living room. That part felt more dreamlike rather than Cooper's reaction.

In isolation, none of the P18 actions are too far out there or inexplicable. It's as an assemblage of uncanny objects, bizzare narrative structure, idiosyncratic dialogue, illogical action/reaction, absurd internal logic.

Cooper using his FBI badge as ID multiple times and everyone just rolling with it as if that would ever be sufficient or even confirm he's called "Dale Cooper" and is an "FBI agent". In the original series, he always flashed his ID card.

It's completely absurd. And even we as audiences just go with it in a trance-like state as if we too are in the dream. We find ways to rationalise the inexplicable.

To me, it's less that they entered "reality" or "our real world" but that we as audiences enter the collective dream of the show, and with it embed the show with aspects of our own realities (and our complicity).

Subjectivity and the constructivist nature of the shared world had us asking who the dreamer is. Until Part 18, it could be argued it was anyone in the show or everyone in the show.

After Part 18, I'd say the answer to "who is the dreamer?" would be "which one of us isn't?"

yeah i can go with that Histeria. good description

I'm pretty set on everything happening after Dale wakes up in the motel as Coop and Laura sharing the same dream.

there's other thoughts that occur to me. Bad Cooper is the one getting obsessed with Judy, asking who is Judy etc.

it's possible I guess Bad Cooper isn't the bumbler everyone presumes, and knows he needs to be amalgamated with his good self to get Diane, Laura to trust him. Diane sees through him a bit and splits, addresses him as Richard, the name of the hell-spawn rape child. Could be parable of Cooper just being driven by his inner id, and not realizing the multitudes we contain that drive us.

Jerry Horne wrote: ↑Thu Dec 02, 2021 10:56 am I'm pretty set on everything happening after Dale wakes up in the motel as Coop and Laura sharing the same dream.

I never thought about that. ( I remember you pointing out on Twitter than when Coop leaves the motel and it being a different motel as being a key scene , but I did not realize that is what you were getting at a shared dream theory.)

To me it could make some sense. Coop goes to sleep and everything changes. Classic dream theory. Carrie hears her mother calling to her just before she screams and wakes up.

I just don't think Lynch is interested in answers and wants to keep us locked up in labyrinthine theories.

I agree, there are quite a few things "post motel" which corresponds with a continued dream. It's just the general feel of the entire world seems different. A whole lot "colder" and "real" in that sense. Twin Peaks feels like any slumbering small time, without mystery or quirkiness or glee, all pretty much dead.

The scream at the end being the waking up is an interesting point.

And, I must add, that final part of the final scene is just TOP NOTCH filmmaking. It gives me physical shivers, every, single, time. Everything is just PERFECTLY executed there.

Jerry Horne wrote: ↑Thu Dec 02, 2021 10:56 am I'm pretty set on everything happening after Dale wakes up in the motel as Coop and Laura sharing the same dream.

This is actually a great theory and I 100% buy it.

On the Twin Peaks subreddit someone posted a comparison between the whisper scenes in Part 2 and Part 18.

In Part 2, the whisper is backwards and Cooper seems to be reacting subdued to whatever Laura is saying. I believe that at this moment she is telling Dale “My father killed me.” Because of the time in the lodges and how they work I believe that this had to have been said in order for Dale to have heard it in the past in S2. This is similar to how Lost Highway worked and “Dick Laurent is dead.”

However in Part 18, the whisper is instead playing normally not backwards. But Cooper’s reaction to Laura’s message is more concerning and distressed. He says “What?”. This plays after Coop has changed the timeline and is also the end credits sequence. However in this alternate timeline the message should be different. I think Laura again told Cooper “My father killed me.” Cooper is lost because he thought he changed the past but instead he realizes that he lost and is deemed to non existence.

https://www.reddit.com/r/twinpeaks/comm ... ame=iossmf

Interesting, I always thought the scenes repeat verbatim. I like your take on the indications. It could be even simpler, though: it's backwards the first time, hence his "huh?" and only forwards when he messes things up; something never meant to be reversed, and horrifying only after the fact.

AXX°N N. wrote: ↑Wed Feb 09, 2022 1:07 pm Interesting, I always thought the scenes repeat verbatim. I like your take on the indications. It could be even simpler, though: it's backwards the first time, hence his "huh?" and only forwards when he messes things up; something never meant to be reversed, and horrifying only after the fact.

Huh that’s pretty interesting. It’s a literal reverse and becomes something so heartbreaking. I wonder if when she’s whispering to him Laura is answering his question at the end of the show. P18 ends with “What year is this?” Followed by Laura’s scream, the cut to black, then the whisper. Could she have been telling him what year it is?