Season 3, The First Draft - Speculation etc.

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N. Needleman
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Re: Season 3, The First Draft - Speculation etc.

Postby N. Needleman » Tue May 15, 2018 5:12 pm

There are two different stories on Piper and I'll leave it at that.
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Mr. Reindeer
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Re: Season 3, The First Draft - Speculation etc.

Postby Mr. Reindeer » Tue May 15, 2018 5:16 pm

N. Needleman wrote:There are two different stories on Piper and I'll leave it at that.


Yep, that’s what makes me curious. But we’re not gonna talk about Piper at all.
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Re: Season 3, The First Draft - Speculation etc.

Postby N. Needleman » Tue May 15, 2018 5:20 pm

I would have killed to see her, as Catherine is a favorite of mine. I think it was likely just a question of scheduling, space and timing. Sadly unless a fourth season is mounted quickly I think the moment for Catherine is gone. I'll assume she's still out scheming in her Blue Pine compound - was that where it was?
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Re: Season 3, The First Draft - Speculation etc.

Postby bosguy1981 » Tue May 15, 2018 5:42 pm

I don't know what the Piper Season 3 stories are but I always wondered if, as an "old school" type of actress from back in the day, who won a Golden Globe Award for Twin Peaks and got Emmy nominations... I figured she had her representatives ask for more money, and wanted to hold out for more money (just out of the principle of it) and then they just wrote her out because they weren't going to start playing favorites that way. Just a thought! Can't imagine they wrote a big arc for her anyway.
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Mr. Reindeer
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Re: Season 3, The First Draft - Speculation etc.

Postby Mr. Reindeer » Tue May 15, 2018 6:54 pm

N. Needleman wrote:I would have killed to see her, as Catherine is a favorite of mine. I think it was likely just a question of scheduling, space and timing. Sadly unless a fourth season is mounted quickly I think the moment for Catherine is gone. I'll assume she's still out scheming in her Blue Pine compound - was that where it was?


Yep, Blue Pine Lodge. She’s a favorite of mine, too. Just one scene between her and Benjamin would have put me over the moon.

It’s interesting that, unlike many other characters absent from the show, Catherine is sidelined even in Mark’s books — apparently becoming a recluse shortly after Pete’s death and not heard from since. I wonder why she didn’t even merit a mention in TFD, whereas Lana and Ernie Niles got long elaborate epilogues.
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NormoftheAndes
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Re: Season 3, The First Draft - Speculation etc.

Postby NormoftheAndes » Wed May 16, 2018 4:15 am

bosguy1981 wrote:
Henrys Hair wrote:I have a feeling the only Audrey scene in the original script is the confrontation with Richard.


I highly doubt they only offered Audrey one scene. Obviously I don't know for sure, but I can't see it.

Until we hear otherwise, my guess is that she wanted scenes that dealt with Audrey's feelings, life, spirit, turmoil, etc. and was not happy to be one part of a large canvas where the issues in her scenes were basically to respond to her violent, dirtbag kid.


Sherilyn Fenn definitely wanted feelings, life, spirit and turmoil in the character of Audrey Horne but instead she got a script for season 3. If you regard this season as the 'doppleganger' season of Twin Peaks then it is devoid of spirit, life and a lot of emotion (not all of course) - so I think Fenn was bound to be in the disappointed camp.

I love your words here bosguy1981. If anyone can tell me a character who has a resolved or 'satisfying' character arc in season 3, then I'd like to hear. Frost and Lynch went out of their way to make every character confusing, incomplete and 'stuck' pretty much. With the exception perhaps of Nadine, Jacoby, Big Ed and Norma. I think the Black Lodge has its influence all over events during this season, but those four characters somehow seem able to dig themselves out of the shit!
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Re: Season 3, The First Draft - Speculation etc.

Postby bosguy1981 » Wed May 16, 2018 9:01 am

Audrey Horne wrote:I do think they reached out to Boyle, and believed they reached out to most of the actors to first see if they wanted to come on board and that the pay would not be much and their shooting schedule would probably only be a few weeks tops for all of them. But I don’t know if she ever went in and read the pages they wrote, or if it never got that far and they never had to write anything for the character. From what I was told, once an actor said they were in, they came into an office and were given just their pages to read privately and asked how they liked it.


Yeah, I forgot about how they didn't "send" the scenes to the actors. They were required to go to an office in Los Angeles to read them. Makes you wonder if Michael Ontkean (who lives in Hawaii) ever got to read his scenes before deciding not to do it.
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Mr. Reindeer
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Re: Season 3, The First Draft - Speculation etc.

Postby Mr. Reindeer » Wed May 23, 2018 5:55 pm

While there were likely various evolving drafts, it’s tough to say with any certainty how different they were from the final product, and to what extent ideas were developed before being dropped. Both DKL and Frost have been incredibly circumspect in discussing the development of the show, even now that it’s all been out there for a year. This is uncharacteristic for DKL. He doesn’t like to talk about the meanings or content of his works, but he has always been shockingly transparent (even enthusiastic) when discussing his process and inspirations (see the Stories features on the Eraserhead and IE DVDs, and analogous features on several other works). While he certainly granted a truly impressive amount of access in the BTS footage, allowing us to witness the way ideas developed while shooting, the unwillingness to talk about the inception/idea stage of this show almost at all is curious for him. I wonder if it was an agreement between Lynch and Frost to remain mum? Perhaps it’s a fear of spoiling potential future seasons?

Another shift in DKL’s attitude is the decision to apparently leave EVERYTHING shot in. It’s interesting that, as recently as LH-era, DKL said he believed enforced runtimes were a good thing artistically, as they forced him to evaluate his work more objectively and determine what the movie could afford to lose. Most of his films are tight, focused works (even IE, IMO) with a lot of interesting material judiciously excised from the final cut. Yet TP:TR, by most accounts, includes pretty much everything filmed (which certainly makes it its own fascinating type of work). I wonder if he just decided the “leave it all in” approach was correct for this particular piece, or if he has changed his mind overall. More pertinent to this thread, did that “kitchen sink” approach extend to the scripting phase? We know DKL wrote new material while filming, and that certain scripted things fell by the wayside or were modified due to real-world concerns, but was ANYTHING major from the original drafts willingly cut, or did L/F remain relatively true to their initial gut impulses?
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Re: Season 3, The First Draft - Speculation etc.

Postby Soolsma » Thu May 24, 2018 5:26 am

I really wonder if there would have been any kind of follow up to Hawk making the trip to Glastonbury Grove. Would he have seen something there? Would Hawk have visited Catherine for cookies, were filming possibilities not so constrained by her condition?
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Re: Season 3, The First Draft - Speculation etc.

Postby Mr. Reindeer » Thu May 24, 2018 5:33 am

Soolsma wrote:I really wonder if there would have been any kind of follow up to Hawk making the trip to Glastonbury Grove. Would he have seen something there? Would Hawk have visited Catherine were filming possibilities not so constrained by her condition?


Sabrina said that Coulson was supposed to film in both WA and CA, so she presumably would have been in location scenes as well as set work (presumably the sheriff’s station?). I would bet that L/F had her involved in the climactic battle.
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Re: Season 3, The First Draft - Speculation etc.

Postby Soolsma » Thu May 24, 2018 5:44 am

California you say. Hmmm, then how about this. Instead of being called by her, Hawk would find Margaret nosing about at Glastonbury Grove where she would relay the message for him.
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Re: Season 3, The First Draft - Speculation etc.

Postby bosguy1981 » Thu Jul 19, 2018 2:15 pm

A few notes on things that were confirmed in the book Room to Dream that I thought would be worth adding to this thread:

Lynch and Frost submitted their script of the full (or then-full) limited series to Showtime in January 2015. That script was 334 pages.

Lynch continued to write additional scenes without Frost (who was off working on Secret History of Twin Peaks), and the finished script completed by Lynch was about 525 pages long if I'm not mistaken. So Lynch added about 200 pages worth of material that was presumably all written without Frost.

According to actor Jake Wardle, Lynch told him "in 2014" about him being a part of the new Twin Peaks and playing the Freddie character with the super-powered green glove. So that settles something I had wondered: did Lynch add Freddie (an old idea of his) to the script after Frost went off to write his books? So this tells us the answer is no, Frost was still writing with Lynch when Freddie was included.

"David is the first one to say there wouldn't be a Twin Peaks without Mark, and the overall arc of the story [in the new season] was there when Mark left to write his book, but David expanded the story substantially after he left," Sabrina Sutherland said. "Things that had been in his head for years were woven into the script."
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Re: Season 3, The First Draft - Speculation etc.

Postby dkenny78 » Tue Jul 24, 2018 12:56 pm

bosguy1981 wrote:Man From Another Place and Philip Gerard[/b]:
It’s too bad about Michael J. Anderson. What a treat it would be to see the Episode 2 Red Room sequence come together again in Part 2 of the new season again.


I would have loved to see how they would have handled the Red Room sequences with Anderson. Would it have been a true 1:1 swap with Strobel, or would both characters been contributing in some fashion? Gerard's function in the new series is so overtly helpful to Cooper and so uncharacteristically *unambiguous* for a lodge denizen, that it's hard for me to see those same duties being carried out by the LMFAP who always cryptic and mysterious in his allegiances. it's one of the reasons the Red Room scenes felt a little shallow to me in 'The Return.' Anderson (and Silva) added so much to the feeling of danger and unpredictability, whereas in 'The Return,' the Red Room felt more like a literal location where (reasonably) clear plot developments were occurring.

As for Ontkean, yes, staging that Mr. C/Truman confrontation scene with Harry instead of Frank would have been amazing, I think I would have also been disappointed with the lack of subsequent screen time good Cooper and Harry would have together.
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N. Needleman
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Re: Season 3, The First Draft - Speculation etc.

Postby N. Needleman » Tue Jul 24, 2018 5:45 pm

IIRC, Al Strobel filled in for MJA a fair bit. But I don't know how much.
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Re: Season 3, The First Draft - Speculation etc.

Postby Soolsma » Wed Jul 25, 2018 2:12 pm

From what we once heard, MJA was supposed to show up in the ''Squeeze his hand off!" scene but didn't, hence the tree popping out of the ground. If that -^ is also true and Lynch considers them interchangeably, it surely says something interesting about Gerard/MIKE/the arm; still very much one and the same.

I'm quite glad it was Gerard who recited the Fire Walk With Me poem and not the tree, but I'd wager it was LMFAP in the script.
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