General Discussion on Season 3 (All Opinions Welcome)

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Soolsma
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Re: General Discussion on Season 3 (All Opinions Welcome)

Postby Soolsma » Tue Nov 19, 2019 1:23 am

Time magazine named TPTR the best show of the decade

https://time.com/5722419/best-tv-shows-2010s-decade/
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Re: General Discussion on Season 3 (All Opinions Welcome)

Postby Mr. Reindeer » Tue Nov 19, 2019 7:28 am

Soolsma wrote:Time magazine named TPTR the best show of the decade

https://time.com/5722419/best-tv-shows-2010s-decade/


Little surprised not to see Mr. Robot on there (and, for that matter, considering the list’s eligibility “rules,” it’s a little weird that Better Call Saul is on there but Breaking Bad isn’t), but otherwise a pretty terrific list.
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Re: General Discussion on Season 3 (All Opinions Welcome)

Postby mtwentz » Tue Nov 19, 2019 11:56 am

Soolsma wrote:Time magazine named TPTR the best show of the decade

https://time.com/5722419/best-tv-shows-2010s-decade/


If I am reading correctly, it wasn't named the best but one of the ten best of the decade.

A great honor nonetheless!
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Re: General Discussion on Season 3 (All Opinions Welcome)

Postby mtwentz » Tue Nov 19, 2019 11:59 am

Mr. Reindeer wrote:
Soolsma wrote:Time magazine named TPTR the best show of the decade

https://time.com/5722419/best-tv-shows-2010s-decade/


Little surprised not to see Mr. Robot on there (and, for that matter, considering the list’s eligibility “rules,” it’s a little weird that Better Call Saul is on there but Breaking Bad isn’t), but otherwise a pretty terrific list.


As much as it is an honor...at the end of the day, just one magazine's opinion.

I tend to defer to the aggregate of opinions. And I think the aggregate would definitely put Breaking Bad on that list.

Yes, there is objective truth out there. It's not all subjective. Twin Peaks The Return was a great (albeit polarizing) show for the decade.
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Re: General Discussion on Season 3 (All Opinions Welcome)

Postby eyeboogers » Tue Nov 19, 2019 12:45 pm

mtwentz wrote:
If I am reading correctly, it wasn't named the best but one of the ten best of the decade.

A great honor nonetheless!


You were not reading that correctly, it is in top ten form
"Who could have guessed that the single best show of the decade would turn out to be a revival? "

Also, aggregate systems from IMDB to Rotten Tomatoes have proven to say very little about the quality of an artwork. Professional serious reviewers are a dying breed, let's appreciate them while they are still around.
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Re: General Discussion on Season 3 (All Opinions Welcome)

Postby LateReg » Tue Nov 19, 2019 1:12 pm

mtwentz wrote:
Mr. Reindeer wrote:
Soolsma wrote:Time magazine named TPTR the best show of the decade

https://time.com/5722419/best-tv-shows-2010s-decade/


Little surprised not to see Mr. Robot on there (and, for that matter, considering the list’s eligibility “rules,” it’s a little weird that Better Call Saul is on there but Breaking Bad isn’t), but otherwise a pretty terrific list.


As much as it is an honor...at the end of the day, just one magazine's opinion.

I tend to defer to the aggregate of opinions. And I think the aggregate would definitely put Breaking Bad on that list.

Yes, there is objective truth out there. It's not all subjective. Twin Peaks The Return was a great (albeit polarizing) show for the decade.


I agree with you on all that. BUT...the aggregate will favor shows that most people agree on. Which is great to make sure you don't miss any of the most important shows, but in time the passionately supported shows will rise up in the ranks and those that everybody loves but are less passionate about will fall off. Some shows, like Breaking Bad, are both universally and passionately loved, however, and so they'll always place highly throughout time. As far as all-time goes, I've frequently pondered how much The Return has raised the value of Twin Peaks, which used to be rightly or wrongly considered a groundbreaking series that was only half-great since it fell off in the second season before concluding with an all-time great finale, to one that now has a stellar, groundbreaking first and third season, and a perfectly fine half-great second season interval in between. It totally changes the whole dynamic/trajectory/legacy of the series. And it's for that odd reason that I also hope for a Season 4, to further enhance the series' legacy, and to see how high it can legitimately climb on all-time lists.

The other thing Twin Peaks: The Return has working against it in any decade-end list is that it is a single season, competing against series with multiple seasons. It's interesting to factor how highly one can rank a single season show against, say, six seasons of Breaking Bad or The Americans, or even three seasons of The Leftovers or Hannibal, or even two seasons of Atlanta or Fleabag. Is there some imaginary line drawn where most people will not allow themselves to rank a single season ahead of multiple-season series of a certain quality? Do any of you have this imaginary line, and where do you draw it? These are the things that occupy my foolish mind. For my money, The Return is the greatest single TV season of (at least) this decade, but how far does that get it when Breaking Bad maintained and upped intensity throughout six straight seasons?

Something else to note: This Time Magazine victory is especially interesting because the magazine had published negative articles on the revival when it aired; critic Daniel D'addario was not a fan. Its victory here demonstrates the polarizing nature of the program, as well as perhaps serves as a pointed rebuttal to the magazine's initial reception.
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Re: General Discussion on Season 3 (All Opinions Welcome)

Postby Soolsma » Tue Nov 19, 2019 8:17 pm

Agreed on Mr. Robot and BB. And I'd vote Rick and Morty over Bojack Horseman any time.

Still always bummed that channel 4's Utopia barely got any recognition anywhere. One of my all time favorites, probably would hit number two when I'd make this list. Oh well.

And yeah, it's just one magazine, but one that's considered prestigious nonetheless. Admitted, I often enough have problems with their choices and lists. *cough, person of the year*
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Re: General Discussion on Season 3 (All Opinions Welcome)

Postby Mr. Reindeer » Thu Dec 05, 2019 5:43 am

Soolsma wrote:Agreed on Mr. Robot and BB. And I'd vote Rick and Morty over Bojack Horseman any time.


Rick and Morty has been on my list for awhile, as I’m a huge Dan Harmon/Community fan, as well as an animation enthusiast, but with my limited viewing time and the massive amount of great TV available, it’s fallen through the cracks. I finally watched the first season. I enjoyed it a whole lot, but so far, it doesn’t have the humanity of Bojack Horseman, which combines a Mad Men-esque exploration of depression and alcoholism and human relationships with wicked animal puns and movie parodies. Rick and Morty is hilarious and high-concept, but it doesn’t speak to my soul the way that Bojack does.
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Re: General Discussion on Season 3 (All Opinions Welcome)

Postby LateReg » Fri Dec 06, 2019 9:30 am

Twin Peaks: The Return topped Cahiers du Cinema's best films of the decade list.
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Re: General Discussion on Season 3 (All Opinions Welcome)

Postby IcedOver » Tue Dec 17, 2019 10:25 pm

I've thought about this since the show aired but haven't read anybody addressing it although I'm sure someone has. Writers choose character names that aren't the same as anybody famous. Why Douglas Jones, then? Doug Jones, while hardly a household name, is well known among fantasy and horror film fans for years of work, usually under tons of makeup and principally from several Guillermo del Toro movies. I'm sure they were just trying to come up with a bland name, but most likely someone connected with the project pointed out the name, especially to Frost because he worked with Jones as the SILVER Surfer through co-writing "Fantastic Four: Rise of the Silver Surfer". I'm not one to ascribe crazy outside fan theories to this show, but it's curious why this name was chosen.
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Re: General Discussion on Season 3 (All Opinions Welcome)

Postby Mr. Reindeer » Wed Dec 18, 2019 6:53 am

IcedOver wrote:I've thought about this since the show aired but haven't read anybody addressing it although I'm sure someone has. Writers choose character names that aren't the same as anybody famous. Why Douglas Jones, then? Doug Jones, while hardly a household name, is well known among fantasy and horror film fans for years of work, usually under tons of makeup and principally from several Guillermo del Toro movies. I'm sure they were just trying to come up with a bland name, but most likely someone connected with the project pointed out the name, especially to Frost because he worked with Jones as the SILVER Surfer through co-writing "Fantastic Four: Rise of the Silver Surfer". I'm not one to ascribe crazy outside fan theories to this show, but it's curious why this name was chosen.


There’s also a US senator of the same name, who was running while TP:TR aired, which led to some funny memes (I believe Frost retweeted some of them). I think it’s just a coincidence. L/F clearly find the name “Dougie” funny, having used it twice. Jones is just a generic last name.
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Re: General Discussion on Season 3 (All Opinions Welcome)

Postby LateReg » Wed Dec 18, 2019 2:37 pm

Vulture named Twin Peaks: The Return the best series of the decade, their write-up highlighting many of the more concrete, medium-shattering reasons that I believe make it the most important series of its time.

I also just want to point out, again, and with a little more enthusiasm this time, that The Return also topped Cahiers du Cinema's list of the best films of the decade! In terms of setting off on the right path towards defining the "film's" ongoing legacy, the victory on one of the handful of reputable and important film magazines - and one of the few whose voters would actually consider it a film - is hugely important.
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Re: General Discussion on Season 3 (All Opinions Welcome)

Postby LateReg » Thu Dec 26, 2019 11:27 am

On The Ringer's The Watch podcast, Sam Esmail once again guest-starred and they did their top ten shows of the decade. Sam Esmail chose Twin Peaks: The Return, stating it was the best by a mile, that it's the 2001: A Space Odyssey of this generation, and that he finds it galling that it's not being talked about more/topping every list.

(I had this feeling when the series ended. It was like TV critics/the internet just went back to business as usual within two weeks of the influx of articles about the finale that doubled as an evaluation of the series as a whole. I know that's how things work, but it just felt really odd to me that people could return to their day jobs and review the next season of something like Stranger Things or whatever after such a milestone had aired. I felt a definite sadness about it at the time - which was lifted only when year-end lists started to flood in - so it was nice to hear Esmail echo those thoughts two years later.)
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Re: General Discussion on Season 3 (All Opinions Welcome)

Postby writersblock » Thu Feb 20, 2020 6:20 am

LateReg wrote:On The Ringer's The Watch podcast, Sam Esmail once again guest-starred and they did their top ten shows of the decade. Sam Esmail chose Twin Peaks: The Return, stating it was the best by a mile, that it's the 2001: A Space Odyssey of this generation, and that he finds it galling that it's not being talked about more/topping every list.

(I had this feeling when the series ended. It was like TV critics/the internet just went back to business as usual within two weeks of the influx of articles about the finale that doubled as an evaluation of the series as a whole. I know that's how things work, but it just felt really odd to me that people could return to their day jobs and review the next season of something like Stranger Things or whatever after such a milestone had aired. I felt a definite sadness about it at the time - which was lifted only when year-end lists started to flood in - so it was nice to hear Esmail echo those thoughts two years later.)


I agree but it had me wondering how long it took for the original Twin Peaks to have an impact on television... All I remember is Northern Exposure taking the mickey out of it... but nothing changed for a while... and now it is cited as a massive influence. Perhaps the Return is slowly making its mark and we just haven't witnessed it yet.

For me, I remember feeling it ruined television for me for a while because nothing else was lighting my F - I - R - E after the Return finished...
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Re: General Discussion on Season 3 (All Opinions Welcome)

Postby N. Needleman » Fri Feb 21, 2020 1:33 am

I think it definitely made its mark. But prestige TV is such a treadmill now that other shows keep taking ink and oxygen. That said, IMO it's not forgotten by critics or creatives and is very valued and revered.
AnotherBlueRoseCase wrote:The Return is clearly guaranteed a future audience among stoners and other drug users.

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