Let's talk changes: how would you change FWWM?

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Hank_Jennings
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Re: Let's talk changes: how would you change FWWM?

Postby Hank_Jennings » Wed Jun 11, 2008 7:54 am

I wouldn't change a thing. I consider FWWM to be a masterpiece, & Lynch's best film. I prefer it to the series because I just love the emotional power it has. Lynch was right to make it a prequel, because Laura Palmer's story is much more powerful than the crap introduced after the murder was solved (sorry, but I despise everything after that, apart from the amazingly memorable final episode by Lynch). IMO, if Lynch did a continuation instead, I think it would be just a run of the mill TV to film adaptation, much like The X-Files film (which I thought was horrible).

As far as the wig problem goes, I would say it is most likely a reference to Stanley Kubrick's Lolita. Lynch has said numerous times that he loves that film, so I wouldn't be surprised if that was his intention. I had seen FWWM long before I saw Lolita, but when I finally did see it, as soon as Sue Lyon appeared on screen, I instantly thought of Laura Palmer (I'm exaggerating, but the hair style did definitely remind me of Laura's in FWWM). I was surprised at how different her hair was when I first saw FWWM, but it never bothered me at all. Sheryl's performance was absolutely incredible, so that is why I didn't care.
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Re: Let's talk changes: how would you change FWWM?

Postby MysteryMan » Mon Jun 23, 2008 8:29 am

I would not change anything that's already in the film as there is nothing wrong in my opinion of what is already there, yet I don't think it's a perfect film. I would add about an hour or so of the deleted scenes to give it a more feel of "Twin Peaks", bring back the characters of Benjamin Horne, Jerry Horne, Sheriff Truman, Deputy Andy, Deputy Hawk, Lucy, Pete Martell, Josie Packard, Doc Hayward and all the others back into the film. It would be more complete that way I think, and I don't think the main story would suffer much. I think actually it would add to the suspense in the story and restore that slightly creepy under-the-surface feeling that the TV series had, exploding in the now well known climax of the film. As it is now it is a very good movie but I think with the right editing it has the chance of becoming a masterpiece!
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Re: Let's talk changes: how would you change FWWM?

Postby missoulamt » Sun Dec 27, 2009 4:00 am

I find the scene where Leland takes Laura and Ronette to the traincar, with Mike following behind, to be more corny than frightening. Maybe they should have left this part to one's own imagination. But then of course, the scenes in the actual traincar are very emotional and powerful, and definitely need to be in the movie, so it's a tough one... :)
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Re: Let's talk changes: how would you change FWWM?

Postby GeekBoyEric74 » Tue Dec 29, 2009 9:25 pm

Way back in the day I was soooo dissapointed that so many scenes from the script were left out or cut short, because I had bought the script at a convention months before the movie had come out and fell in love with it. So when I saw the movie, I just kept seeing the stuff that was missing. Now though, all these years later, I mostly feel differently. I can't imagine the introductions of Laura and Donna playing out onscreen the way it does in the script (where the spend several pages chit chatting about boys and other crap) In my mind, it plays much better now, with them walking and the Twin Peaks theme playing over their words. Of course I missed all the scenes with the other members of the show's cast, but almost none of them added to the overall story, or flowed in a non jarring way-we just cut to Pete and Ed talking for example, and if you hadn't seen the show you would not know or care who these people are. It would not have worked.I for one never was bothered by the lack of Lara Flynn Boyle (I found Moira Kelly more than suitable) And It was YEARS later before I ever noticed a change to the Palmer house. So none of that stuff bugged me at all. Having said that, here is what I WOULD change if I could.

#1. The one, crucial scene that should be put back in the movie, and should never have been cut: The original introduction to the Palmer family, where we see them at the dinner table-dysfunctional, but loving. I remember once watching FWWM with a friend who had not seen the series (but knew who the killer was because someone else had told her) and the one part that confused her was when Laura flipped out after Leland cames walking out of the house after she sees BOB. She turned to me and said "Who is that guy?" It would have been SO much more impactful (not to mention make even better the later BOB infused dinner scene) if we'd seen a happy dinner scene first. For the life of me, I still don't know why they cut this scene.

#2. Better continuity with the series.
-again, one has to assume that at some point, someone might watch the movie THEN see the series. It would have been nice to see references to things Laura was said to have done in the show, even if we don't have time to see them. Most glaring of these were her relationships with Johnny Horne and Josie Packard as their tutors. While having a scene would have been nice (even back in the day, I never understood why they chose to film a Truman/Josie scene instead of a Laura/Josie scene -It would have been great to see "Now I understand how you feel about your husband's death" played out) An offhand reference to say, her mother about having to tutor Johhny Horne and Mrs Packard today would have worked. Also, Dr.Jacoby should have at least been mentioned. The absence of any mention of these relationships makes it kind of feel like the Laura of the series was different from the Laura of the movie. It would have been kind of how Coop refences an FBI agent named Sam in the Pilot-we don't see him but it creates nice continuity with the movie. Other than those three relationships (Jacoby, Johnny Horne and Josie) I think the movie does a great job of keeping continuity with the series. But those will always bug me and seem sloppy to not make any referneces to those characters.

#3. A Coda to the series
-originally in the script, after Laura is murdered, we get a title card that says 30 DAYS LATER" and cuts to moments after the end of the series, with Coop now possesed by BOB and talking to Truman and Dr. Hayward. It would have been nice, seeing as this was the final scene in the Twin Peaks timeline, if they'd taken a moment to wrap up some of the character's very "up in the air" fates for the loyal viewers who stuck with the show. Having Truman and Hayward say something like "Annie's fine, but Audrey and Ben Horne are hospitalized, and Pete Martell and Leo Johnson are dead" (or whatever) I believe it is a creator's right to kill any character he wants, but to leave their fates up in the air is kind of jacked, and this was Lynch's opportunity to fix that, and put a proper bookend on the series. I doubt we'd have as much request for more Twin Peaks if we'd had even a little bit of closure like that. (I know many will say Coop being possesed by BOB is a cliffhanger as well, but considering the movie presented the "Good Coop" as being with Laura as his ultimate fate, I don't think that has to be viewed as a cliffhanger neccesarily. The others all totally are) THEN cut to the wonderful as-is final moments in the Red Room.

And that is more or less it, as I love the movie very much as it is otherwise. Of course I would still love to see the deleted scenes finished, but find that most of them didn't fit in the movie anyway. But those are the thing I would change.
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Re: Let's talk changes: how would you change FWWM?

Postby Brad D » Wed Dec 30, 2009 8:25 pm

sheryl lee's wig is a huge grievance of mine. the film has grown on me considerably over the past few years, but wow that wig kills it for me. really, why couldnt they have just put in some extensions? i also would much rather have had lara flynn boyle and a couple of scenes with richard beymer and russ tamblyn.

storywise, i think its best as it is. i hope one day we can see the coop/truman/heyward scene one day but i think that its best left off the end. i really really wish there had been another film to tie everything up, but then again i do appreciate all the room to dream with exactly what we have.
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Re: Let's talk changes: how would you change FWWM?

Postby Black Rose » Sat May 22, 2010 12:51 pm

I really did not like the film.

There were a few things that sorta bugged, such as the sets, the hair, the re-casting, the manner of Laura's death, and so forth (and FWIW, I think MK would have made a great Donna and some of the sets would have been better than the originals).

I think they retconned three things that really killed it for me.

The nature of Leland/Bob and the other spirits was changed from the series, and the stuff with the ring seemed to be thrown in randomly. One of the questions left from the series that I think should have been left open-ended was whether Leland knew he was the killer. Overall, I think it would have been better to elaborate on the mythos from the series instead of giving us new stuff.

The part about Laura and Teresa Banks being friends seemed really off to me. Would Laura (not to mention Leland and Ronnette) really drive across the state to party with this random chick? Laura's world was in Twin Peaks.

The worst part is that Laura was not the Laura we knew and loved from the series. Laura from the series was kind, sweet, flirtatious, soft-spoken, and popular, which made her death a shock to the community. The film Laura was so dour, so angry, and so odd the whole time... we never saw the personality that Laura showed to everyone around her. I would have preferred a film that showed the happy, smiling Laura from the picnic video, the seductive Laura from Jacoby's tapes, and the mysterious Laura from Cooper's vision, as well as the "real" Laura hidden inside.
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Re: Let's talk changes: how would you change FWWM?

Postby charles » Mon May 24, 2010 4:41 pm

Uh....What WOULDN'T I change about Fire Walk With Me? Oh yeah. There's one thing and one thing only: Irene.
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Re: Let's talk changes: how would you change FWWM?

Postby missoulamt » Tue May 25, 2010 7:44 am

Black Rose wrote:The worst part is that Laura was not the Laura we knew and loved from the series. Laura from the series was kind, sweet, flirtatious, soft-spoken, and popular, which made her death a shock to the community. The film Laura was so dour, so angry, and so odd the whole time...


I thought the way she acted in FWWM actually was the perfect counterpoint to the Laura we knew from the series. This was the "night persona", so to speak, and I think it really illustrated well what she was going through. A few scenes come to mind: her meeting the Log Lady outside the Roadhouse before going in. The combination of acting and music is just brilliant there, and there are other memorable scenes as well: her acting in the ending scene, meeting James in the locker room and telling him she's lost like a chicken in a cornfield (if I remember correctly) etc. Do you think this was a reference to the planet of corn by the way, or just a coincidence?
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Re: Let's talk changes: how would you change FWWM?

Postby nemo » Wed May 26, 2010 9:50 am

I looked into the script: Laura Palmer said:,,I'm gone... long gone like a turkey through the corn." The metaphor is quite interesting, if one starts to ponder on it.
English isn't my native language, but I think, the metaphor is of a turkey killed and laid on the plate covered with corn too much, so one can't see the turkey under it. The question is, if this phrase can be meant literally, I mean ,,the turkey is gone through the cornfiled". I would say yes. I wonder, what would native speakers say. But I doubt, that it would be a reference to the creamed corn planet/field/place. I believe, this idea didn't have any real form. At least by David Lynch. Maybe it was some kind of concept, discussed at some moment by other authors during the series. (The possible allusion to it can be found in the Log Lady introduction.) But there was no real opportunity for its elaboration. After the end of the series it was obvious, that there won't be the third season. And after the movie was released it was clear, there won't be any TWIN PEAKS ever.
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Re: Let's talk changes: how would you change FWWM?

Postby missoulamt » Wed May 26, 2010 10:48 am

Yes, but although the idea of a planet of corn wasn't explored in FWWM, there were still hints of it, wasn't there? I'm thinking of the scenes from the convenience store, where they sit eating creamed corn/garmonbozia?

The "lost like a turkey in the cornfield" bit was probably a coincidence, still it's interesting to ponder if it had something to do with Laura now being lost to the "other realm"...
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Re: Let's talk changes: how would you change FWWM?

Postby nemo » Wed May 26, 2010 11:05 am

So is it the phrase you wrote, which is in the movie? I don't want to rewatch it due to some reasons. Garmonbozia could be meant as an element of the other realm as a concentration of pain and fear, but if the planet doesn't exist, what Robert Engels proved in fact, cos it wasn't shot, then garmonbozia is just some kind of materialisation of pain, sorrow and what else, which take a form of a creamed corn transmitted to their realm. I wonder, why should they feed on it, if there is a planet/field full of creamed corn. Maybe it was a reason, why they should return to it. But in my eyes, it contradicts the Black Lodge concept totally. I think, this is an absolutely parallel idea, which was slightly introduced maybe in the middle of the series, but shifted to the more esoteric White Lodge/Black Lodge concept. It's a pity, that David Lynch seldom gives interviews on such matters of TWIN PEAKS.
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Re: Let's talk changes: how would you change FWWM?

Postby TheArm » Tue Jun 01, 2010 4:41 pm

The first time I saw the film, I was also annoyed with Laura's character, in the sense that has been mentioned above - that she spends most of the movie at the bottom of a dark black pit of madness and despair. She's not even teetering on the edge of the pit - she's all the way at the bottom. So we don't get any of the lovely, sunny Laura who we hear about throughout the series. Then it occurred to me that this is probably because we are literally seeing Laura over the last 7 days of her life, so literally from the time we first meet her in FWWM, her time is almost up. At this point she's already gone through 4 or 5 years of systematic abuse and corruption at the hands of BOB, so the movie is literally the portrait of a dying girl. Perhaps if the movie had taken place over more of her life before her death (spanning more of the time of the diary), we would have seen the other sides of her character?
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Re: Let's talk changes: how would you change FWWM?

Postby missoulamt » Sun Aug 15, 2010 2:18 pm

I've noticed a few people saying they are huge fans of the show but don't like FWWM at all. I always found this interesting. It's not as if they are completely different things?
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Re: Let's talk changes: how would you change FWWM?

Postby Black Rose » Mon Jan 24, 2011 11:58 pm

missoulamt wrote:I've noticed a few people saying they are huge fans of the show but don't like FWWM at all. I always found this interesting. It's not as if they are completely different things?



I'm rewatching the end of the first season, and (since I was the one who ripped on the film upthread) part of the joy of the series for me was that you just got little tastes of each character in each episode. Other than Cooper, most of the characters have one or two scenes per episode. It's quantity, not quality.
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Re: Let's talk changes: how would you change FWWM?

Postby my socks are on fire » Mon Jan 31, 2011 9:14 pm

Donna, that's about it. I just want her to be LFB, she had a certain flair that MK doesn't. And she was considerably taller. The scenes with Maddy and Donna in the series leave me feeling a big 'could've been'...

It wasn't the nudity, was it? Just a general falling out between her/KM/DL, right? I hope it wasn't the nudity, because that wasn't really necessary.

Otherwise, a gem. The wig - didn't notice it the first time, like how it upsets people now. Maddy wore a wig, right? Vertigo? Lolita? Just another chance for DL to pile on the simulacra...

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