'Twin Peaks: The Final Dossier' Novel by Mark Frost 10/31 (SPOILERS)

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Re: 'Twin Peaks: The Final Dossier' Novel by Mark Frost 10/31 (SPOILERS)

Postby Methedrome » Thu Nov 02, 2017 1:49 pm

The motive to mate with Judy to bring about the end of the world.
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Re: 'Twin Peaks: The Final Dossier' Novel by Mark Frost 10/31 (SPOILERS)

Postby dkenny78 » Thu Nov 02, 2017 2:19 pm

The motive to mate with Judy to bring about the end of the world.
But didn't that already kinda happen with Sarah/Joudy mating with Leland/BOB to produce Laura? Why would a union with the Double/BOB and Sarah/Joudy be any more calamitous than that?

The only explanation I can think of is that the Double is more inherently evil than Leland because it's a demon possessing an evil twin vs. a demon possessing an otherwise good man. But, if that's the case, shouldn't Joudy really be possessing Sarah's Double instead of Sarah herself?
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Re: 'Twin Peaks: The Final Dossier' Novel by Mark Frost 10/31 (SPOILERS)

Postby kitty666cats » Thu Nov 02, 2017 2:22 pm

The motive to mate with Judy to bring about the end of the world.
But didn't that already kinda happen with Sarah/Joudy mating with Leland/BOB to produce Laura? Why would a union with the Double/BOB and Sarah/Joudy be any more calamitous than that?

The only explanation I can think of is that the Double is more inherently evil than Leland because it's a demon possessing an evil twin vs. a demon possessing an otherwise good man. But, if that's the case, shouldn't Joudy really be possessing Sarah's Double instead of Sarah herself?
I am going with the thought that Sarah Palmer doesn't become fully possessed by Judy until it's released from the glass box, the Frog Bug is just something that was planted in her that marks her as a person that Judy can possess
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Re: Final Dossier Spoilers

Postby bowisneski » Thu Nov 02, 2017 2:31 pm

Anyway, Audrey Horne kind of disappointed about her backstory in the book. Doesn't explain how she's at the roadhouse yet in a white room at the same time.
My current assumption is that married to Charlie Audrey is in the Twin Peaks we knew and institutionalized/white room Audrey in the Twin Peaks we see in the finale.
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Re: 'Twin Peaks: The Final Dossier' Novel by Mark Frost 10/31 (SPOILERS)

Postby a whole damn town » Thu Nov 02, 2017 2:40 pm

Lil nitpick about this book: Albert's out-of-character-for-the-times use of the phrase "trigger warning" is not only silly but a lil self-righteously projecting. It's like Frost writing as Albert, which it IS but breaks suspension of disbelief. He didn't think this through enough which is kind of expected of him considering how he acts on social media. :?
Not to mention, that term wouldn't become widely used until mid-'00s at the very earliest. Either Cooper's meddling with time caused language to develop in a funny way, or that's some seriously sloppy writing.
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Re: 'Twin Peaks: The Final Dossier' Novel by Mark Frost 10/31 (SPOILERS)

Postby dkenny78 » Thu Nov 02, 2017 3:07 pm

I am going with the thought that Sarah Palmer doesn't become fully possessed by Judy until it's released from the glass box, the Frog Bug is just something that was planted in her that marks her as a person that Judy can possess
Ah, good point. Yeah, I could see that being the case. But this sort of encapsulates the overall problem I have with 'The Return'. The original 'Twin Peaks' certainly left a lot up to the viewer's interpretation, but that was sort-of 'gravy', and most of the show could be enjoyed and understood based on what was actually depicted onscreen.

But reading TFD reinforces my feeling that so much of 'The Return' outright *requires* viewers to piece together a very elaborate interpretation of events, based on the smallest of breadcrumbs. And while I'm all for fiction that makes you think, I do feel authors bear some responsibility for leading viewers/readers to a certain conclusion, and in my opinion, 'The Return' fails that test.
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Re: 'Twin Peaks: The Final Dossier' Novel by Mark Frost 10/31 (SPOILERS)

Postby SpookyDollhouse » Thu Nov 02, 2017 7:08 pm

I am going with the thought that Sarah Palmer doesn't become fully possessed by Judy until it's released from the glass box, the Frog Bug is just something that was planted in her that marks her as a person that Judy can possess
Ah, good point. Yeah, I could see that being the case. But this sort of encapsulates the overall problem I have with 'The Return'. The original 'Twin Peaks' certainly left a lot up to the viewer's interpretation, but that was sort-of 'gravy', and most of the show could be enjoyed and understood based on what was actually depicted onscreen.

But reading TFD reinforces my feeling that so much of 'The Return' outright *requires* viewers to piece together a very elaborate interpretation of events, based on the smallest of breadcrumbs. And while I'm all for fiction that makes you think, I do feel authors bear some responsibility for leading viewers/readers to a certain conclusion, and in my opinion, 'The Return' fails that test.
I disagree. Authors don't have any responsibilities beyond telling their story. If you feel understanding it requires a lot of thinking, then maybe that's the kind of thing they wrote, and if anybody doesn't enjoy that kind of thing it's not for them.
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Re: Final Dossier Spoilers

Postby cgs027 » Thu Nov 02, 2017 8:19 pm

Also it seems That Harry Truman is suffering from Cancer.Mr.C killed Briggs and Ruth Davenport and he is the owner of The Glass Box in New York
None of this is particularly shocking, but use spoiler tags!
While not shocking, it unfortunately confirms how nonsensical the whole "I want those coordinates" plotline was. If Mr.C was at the scene where Ruth Davenport was killed, all he had to do was crib the coordinates off of her arm... no need to have to get Ray to obtain them via this unnecessary secretary character, etc... Would have made more sense if the Woodsmen acted on their own and took everyone out at that scene.
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Re: 'Twin Peaks: The Final Dossier' Novel by Mark Frost 10/31 (SPOILERS)

Postby krishnanspace » Thu Nov 02, 2017 9:23 pm

The motive to mate with Judy to bring about the end of the world.
But Bob was in Leland and Judy in Sarah before.They mated before but the world didn't end
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Re: 'Twin Peaks: The Final Dossier' Novel by Mark Frost 10/31 (SPOILERS)

Postby cowwithfivelegs » Thu Nov 02, 2017 9:38 pm

The motive to mate with Judy to bring about the end of the world.
But Bob was in Leland and Judy in Sarah before.They mated before but the world didn't end
I'm not saying I buy Mark's version as Lynch's, but I assume that the Fireman prevented this from happening through the creation of the golden Laura orb.
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Re: 'Twin Peaks: The Final Dossier' Novel by Mark Frost 10/31 (SPOILERS)

Postby mtwentz » Fri Nov 03, 2017 3:57 am

Just finished the Final Dossier last night. Overall B+ in my opinion, missing an 'A' for the following reasons:

1. the Vivian storyline, which did seem like an attempt to clean up continuity errors from Secret History.

2. Explaining way too many mysteries from the series. Did we really need Tamara to describe that the lights went out in the Sheriff's station and Gordon suddenly appearing with Cooper and Diane in the Boiler Room of the Great Northern in Episode 17? Or did Sarah definitively have to be called out as the frog/moth girl, thus killing our debates and speculation on this point?

Lynch can say all we want this is Mark Frost's Twin Peaks, but this book just killed a lot of debate and speculation and I feel it spoon fed answers to an audience that did not need to be spoon fed. But overall, the book was compelling and extremely well written, so I still enjoyed it very much.
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Re: 'Twin Peaks: The Final Dossier' Novel by Mark Frost 10/31 (SPOILERS)

Postby Xavi » Fri Nov 03, 2017 4:24 am

In TFD Tamara Preston tells the story. It is her story, it is from her perspective. There is even something more, which is best worded in Lucy's vocabulary; "Tamara Preston? Which one?"

BTW I do not appreciate two versions that exist at the same time. I will always prefer Lynch's universe, which is Twin Peaks Season 3 as shown on TV.
“David and I talked for a year before we ever started working, so there’s no doubt that some of those ideas [in the new book] came up during that period of time. But also, you know, it was [me saying], “David, you go make the show, and do what you do best, and I’m gonna do that with the books.” So you have to trust your partner.”

~ Mark Frost about his book TFD
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Re: 'Twin Peaks: The Final Dossier' Novel by Mark Frost 10/31 (SPOILERS)

Postby mtwentz » Fri Nov 03, 2017 5:13 am

In TFD Tamara Preston tells the story. It is her story, it is from her perspective. There is even something more, which is best worded in Lucy's vocabulary; "Tamara Preston? Which one?"

BTW I do not appreciate two versions that exist at the same time. I will always prefer Lynch's universe, which is Twin Peaks Season 3 as shown on TV.
“David and I talked for a year before we ever started working, so there’s no doubt that some of those ideas [in the new book] came up during that period of time. But also, you know, it was [me saying], “David, you go make the show, and do what you do best, and I’m gonna do that with the books.” So you have to trust your partner.”

~ Mark Frost about his book TFD
I do think, though, that Frost's version will shut all debate about the frog moth girl being Sarah Palmer, whether that's what Lynch intended or not.

On the other hand, I think most fans will not necessarily agree with Frost's take on Audrey. We will just have to see.
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Re: 'Twin Peaks: The Final Dossier' Novel by Mark Frost 10/31 (SPOILERS)

Postby LonelySoul » Fri Nov 03, 2017 5:14 am

I have a question about everyone's favorite subplot.

Shockingly, Evelyn Marsh and (indirectly) Malcolm Sloan and Jeffrey Marsh are all mentioned in this book. They're not characters I ever expected to hear about ever again. Anyway, Preston says something along the lines of how James skips town during the trial for which he was supposed testify against the defendants, Evelyn and the person posing as her brother. Defendants - plural. Is Preston implying that Malcolm did not die from his gunshot wound? Or perhaps she just worded things really poorly?
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Re: 'Twin Peaks: The Final Dossier' Novel by Mark Frost 10/31 (SPOILERS)

Postby Manwith » Fri Nov 03, 2017 5:28 am

And are we meant to infer that Sarah Judith Nowack Palmer is indeed "Judy"?
I don't think she *is* Judy, but rather she has been harboring Judy ever since the encounter with the bug in the '50s. It would appear that Judy only rarely exercises control over her, though. Maybe Sarah's own psychic abilities were a sort of side effect of being in contact with a being as powerful as Judy?
Frost implies the world will end if Judy and Bob meet, so I don't think she's been harboring Sarah until recently, the frog has been dormant. Otherwise I don't see why the world didn't end much, much earlier if Judy and Bob were living together...

Also it doesn't make sense that Dopplecoop needs the coordinates to Judy if he's been living with her as Bob when she was Sarah Palmer...

The whole thing is ridiculously convoluted... two demons are living together but don't know the other is a demon (I guess???), and they give birth to a savior figure...

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