Part 7 - There's a body all right (SPOILERS)

[Fireboob]

My thoughts.

The guy who walks past the morg is defo the guy from the convenience store. The use the same noise when he is on camera. When he waves his arm up n down on while sat in the chair in the scene in fwwm that sound effect was used in the corridor scene but it had a filter on it.


I think jefferies. Briggs. Annie and more will turn out to have dopplegangers

[Agent Earle]

Seems like pretty sloppy attitude to me, if that's the case. Would like the writers/showrunners to show a little more respect for the series' narrative history (and the old viewers)... New viewers can always look it up, it's not like the original material is unavailable at this point. And if anyone's watching this show without prior knowledge - even though the fact that it's a continuation of the 25+ years old show was practically the only selling point ever since the announcement -, I wonder why he's bothering, frankly.

Exposition dumps are a writing no-no. It feels less like natural dialogue and more like name dropping references. I mean, at that point you could argue; well, they should've mentioned Norma, but, then they should've mentioned that it took place at Miss Twin Peaks, but, then you have to mention Windom Earle and his killing spree, oh, right, you have to also mention that Earle was Coops old partner who wanted revenge. At that point, you might as well just rewatch Season 2! So, frankly, your approach is the sloppy one ..

They gave what you needed to know. We've seen Norma already. Annie being her sister matters nil to the main thread of the story (and hell, barely mattered in the original run, it was just an easy tactic to drop a character in from thin air; Norma didn't seem to care at all that her sister was missing in the season 2 finale).

Frankly, I find this attitude baffling, especially considering the last couple episodes have been more respectful of the original run than most would've expected (Heidi, a possible Josie reference, not writing Harry out completely, Annie name drop, Doc Hayward talking about Coop, diary pages). I think you're expecting a retread more than a continuation.

Yeah, right - one of the main guys of this universe changes the name of a character that went under another name before our very eyes and ears, and I'm the sloppy one (I think we can now safely drop the "alternative timeline" theory that some here have clinged on to when confronted with many many many inconsistencies in the book). True, that was the tie-in book, this is the series, but still - it came from the SAME creative team and if that devil-may-care attitude towards previously established facts will eventually prevail in the new series, well, sorry, but that's just S L O P P Y, moreover, it's L A Z Y in my book, I don't care how you justify it. Frankly, what baffles me is that you're apparently okay with that kind of poor work one would expect from some cheap fan fiction (or not even there). And don't give me "TP has always had a checkered history when it came to consistency" routine as an excuse - they had 25 friggin' years to get their act together. Well, or at least 3 or thereabouts years that reportedly took them to write the third season. Didn't watch the old series except for the Pilot and the Finale? Back to the old drawing board, say I.

Who's talking about exposition dump??? A name here and a reference to an event there would hurt no-one, except totally fresh viewers, and I stand by my previous statement that they shouldn't proceed with what's more than clearly marketed as continuation of a franchise without arming themselves with knowledge of what came before. And now that you mention it, I don't see a thing wrong with acknowledging Earle, in fact, I damn well expect it. This new season puts Cooper front and center - how credible can it be without doing justice to the man who was probably the single most important person in his life outside his parents? Or should we just forget he existed just because some fans don't like him? Again, SLOPPY and FAN SERVICE-Y.

[boske]

We should know if we are dealing with Briggs doppleganger soon once the deady body fingerprints are analyzed. If the left ring fingerprint is reversed it will point to a doppleganger.

[Denise's Pieces]

I love that I don't have any wants or expectations from the show. I'm just along for the ride and will go wherever Lynch and Frost decide to take me.

What if they take you up a dark alley and steal your wallet and shoes? What then? WHAT THEN?

He'd be the happiest victim of mugging in human history, which ain't bad !


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Truth!

[mtwentz]

Josie's best scene was the blackmail head-to-head with Ben, that was the closest to the real Josie we saw. Although, as they speculate after her death, I'm not sure even she knew who the real Josie was at a certain point.

I thought the best scene was with Hank Jennings at the end of Season 1. Both her and Mulkey did a great job in that scene, in my opinion.

[Ragnell]

Cooper smashed his head into a mirror at the conclusion of season 2 after seeing Bob in the mirror. He never acted normal for what we know after Cooper or, more likely, his doppelganger got ejected from the Black Lodge. Unless this single instance of "crazy" was the only time anything odd happened to him. I doubt that though.

EvilCoop smashed his head into the mirror. GoodCoop was already in the lodge. Hence the "normal" behaviour before he went back through the electric outlet and became "DougieCoop".

Please don't mix up those various Coopers.

I am not mixing them up. At this point, we have no link between evil Coop, roaming out of the Lodge and Dougie Jones. For all we know so far, the personal continuity is still with the "bad" Coop. He's the one that appears "real" to the outside world as he emerged physically out of the Black Lodge. No one knows about Dougie bearing any semblance to FBI agent Dale Cooper.

Well, I wrote the post mentioning both. So I meant that in Parts 1-3, before he traveled through the electrical socket into... whatever passes for reality in the Twin Peaks Universe, The Good Dale was acting like himself. Once he got to the physical world, and replaced Dougie. I say replaced because he didn't have any of the items Dougie had (keys to the car, wallet, ID) but he did have the Great Northern Key and at least two characters commented on the weight loss. As for the physical resemblance? We've seen Dougie. If Dougie was supposed to be someone who didn't look like Cooper, they would have had another actor play him in the Red Room.

So its clear that Good Dale has left the lodge and now has his own physical body and space somehow. The key arriving at the Great Northern establishes that the Vegas parts share a physical plane and timeline with the Twin Peaks parts, so there's definitely personal continuity following Good Dale.

My original point was that when Good Dale left the lodge, BOTH remaining Coops were incapacitated at once. Then both of them got a period of rest and recovery. We saw Evil Cooper get better fast, but he has a spiritual passenger that might be helping with that. Good Dale's help is all external, but Good Dale has more to recover from. Still, he's considerably better each part. Even before the attack, we saw he was doing better. Instead of sitting blankly he was intently drawing at his desk. He had the presence of mind to ignore Tony but pay attention to Rhonda. He's a little bit more aware each ep. I don't think it's out of the realm of possibility that now that Evil Cooper is free to act, Good Dale may wake up. Or at least experience a big enough leap in agency to start driving his own plot.

[WhiteLodge90]

Josie's best scene was the blackmail head-to-head with Ben, that was the closest to the real Josie we saw. Although, as they speculate after her death, I'm not sure even she knew who the real Josie was at a certain point.

I thought the best scene was with Hank Jennings at the end of Season 1. Both her and Mulkey did a great job in that scene, in my opinion.

I agree that scene is my favorite with her but Chen's acting chemistry with Jack Nance was really good as well. For the most part I always enjoyed their scenes together as well. She also had a few good ones with Truman all though those were definitely more soap opera esque

[Mr. Reindeer]

The Woodsmen and Electrician in FWWM have always been fascinating. DKL got two very accomplished actors, Calvin Lockhart and Jürgen Prochnow, to be day players essentially unrecognizable under hats and fake beards. Granted, both actors had prior working relationships with DKL, and maybe they just wanted to hang out on set and be part of TP for the day as a lark (DKL certainly isn't above this sort of thing...see William H. Macy in IE, and likely many actors in TP:TR such as Richard Chamberlain). But casting (relatively) familiar/recognizable actors as Lodge spirits, when up until then the spirits had all been played by distinctive-looking unknowns, felt so incongruous. Always wondered if there was a further plan there.

Wonder if we'll find out whether the two "Woodsmen" we've now seen in TP:TR are meant to be the same two spirits from the film, or if there are an infinite number of bearded Woodsmen wandering the Lodge. Up to this point in the new show, DKL has avoided any recasts (and on the original I believe the only recasts ever were Johnny, Ronette's dad and Donna -- as well as I guess the bizarre Toad retcon/coincidence/confusion). I'm hoping he continues that, and just treats these as new Woodsmen, even though in this case a recast would feel more acceptable than probably anywhere else. It would have been super cool if Prochnow had returned to make something more of the role, but the way these figures are being deployed on the show gives them a spookiness that might have been undercut if a famous actor were playing the role.

I'm torn on the long-standing theory that one of the Woodsmen is Sam Lanterman. This theory has been around for probably close to 25 years, and the burned appearance of the new Woodsmen seems to throw fuel on that fire (heh, sorry). On the one hand, that would be kind of cool...but it feels a little too fan service-y and kind of obvious/literal for DKL. Guess we'll see. I'd be in favor of anything that gets Coulson on screen one more time tho'.

[Leebob]

... The key arriving at the Great Northern establishes that the Vegas parts share a physical plane and timeline with the Twin Peaks parts...

Agreed - I am guilty of spurring on a lot of the speculation that Cooper had returned from the lodge to an earlier timeline (2003), but I was glad to see the key arrive in "current day" (2014, 2015?) Twin Peaks thus ending that speculation and proving me wrong.

[LateReg]

Seems like pretty sloppy attitude to me, if that's the case. Would like the writers/showrunners to show a little more respect for the series' narrative history (and the old viewers)... New viewers can always look it up, it's not like the original material is unavailable at this point. And if anyone's watching this show without prior knowledge - even though the fact that it's a continuation of the 25+ years old show was practically the only selling point ever since the announcement -, I wonder why he's bothering, frankly.

Exposition dumps are a writing no-no. It feels less like natural dialogue and more like name dropping references. I mean, at that point you could argue; well, they should've mentioned Norma, but, then they should've mentioned that it took place at Miss Twin Peaks, but, then you have to mention Windom Earle and his killing spree, oh, right, you have to also mention that Earle was Coops old partner who wanted revenge. At that point, you might as well just rewatch Season 2! So, frankly, your approach is the sloppy one ..

They gave what you needed to know. We've seen Norma already. Annie being her sister matters nil to the main thread of the story (and hell, barely mattered in the original run, it was just an easy tactic to drop a character in from thin air; Norma didn't seem to care at all that her sister was missing in the season 2 finale).

Frankly, I find this attitude baffling, especially considering the last couple episodes have been more respectful of the original run than most would've expected (Heidi, a possible Josie reference, not writing Harry out completely, Annie name drop, Doc Hayward talking about Coop, diary pages). I think you're expecting a retread more than a continuation.

Yeah, right - one of the main guys of this universe changes the name of a person that went under another name before our very eyes and ears, and I'm the sloppy one (I think we can now safely drop the "alternative timeline" theory that some here have clinged on to when confronted with many many many inconsistencies in the book). True, that was the tie-in book, this is the series, but still - it came from the SAME creative team and if that devil-may-care attitude towards previously established facts will eventually prevail in the new series, well, sorry, but that's just S L O P P Y, moreover, it's L A Z Y in my book, I don't care how you justify it. Frankly, what baffles me is that you're apparently okay with that kind of poor work one would expect from some cheap fan fiction (or not even there). And don't give me "TP has always had a checkered history when it came to consistency" routine as an excuse - they had 25 friggin' years to get their act together. Well, or at least 3 or thereabouts years that reportedly took them to write the third season. Didn't watch the old series except for the Pilot and the Finale? Back to the old drawing board, say I.

Who's talking about exposition dump??? A name here and a reference to an event there would hurt no-one, except totally fresh viewers, and I stand by my previous statement that they shouldn't proceed with what's more than clearly marketed as continuation of a franchise without arming themselves with knowledge of what came before. And now that you mention it, I don't see a thing wrong with acknowledging Earle, in fact, I damn well expect it. This new season puts Cooper front and center - how credible can it be without doing justice to the man who was probably the single most important person in his life outside his parents? Or should we just forget he existed just because some fans don't like him? Again, SLOPPY and FAN SERVICE-Y.

A. Let's wait and see about the errors in the tie-in book.

B. I personally don't care if Lynch/Frost stick to the continuity unless its important to the story they want to tell. It's more about feeling to me than exactness, and if the creators want to throw out certain elements they weren't fans of, I think that's their right, especially since they view this as a whole new thing, a chance to take control in ways that they regret not doing in the original series. (Even if it was Lynch's fault he went away, he did say ideally he would have directed every episode.) I would rather have certain elements not mentioned at all than find the creators beholden to things that they no longer have an interest in.

C. On points A and B, I'd say that even if there are errors and changes, it can still make things interesting and mysterious. Maybe annoying to hardcore fans who know the series inside out and have favorite characters and who find meaning in things that the creators don't, but interesting in light of the creators' wishes. I don't find any of the changes sloppy or lazy, but rather interesting, the sign of artists making what they want to make in the current moment. Seizing that moment is what this is all about.

[Nighthawk]

EvilCoop smashed his head into the mirror. GoodCoop was already in the lodge. Hence the "normal" behaviour before he went back through the electric outlet and became "DougieCoop".

Please don't mix up those various Coopers.

I am not mixing them up. At this point, we have no link between evil Coop, roaming out of the Lodge and Dougie Jones. For all we know so far, the personal continuity is still with the "bad" Coop. He's the one that appears "real" to the outside world as he emerged physically out of the Black Lodge. No one knows about Dougie bearing any semblance to FBI agent Dale Cooper.

Well, I wrote the post mentioning both. So I meant that in Parts 1-3, before he traveled through the electrical socket into... whatever passes for reality in the Twin Peaks Universe, The Good Dale was acting like himself. Once he got to the physical world, and replaced Dougie. I say replaced because he didn't have any of the items Dougie had (keys to the car, wallet, ID) but he did have the Great Northern Key and at least two characters commented on the weight loss. As for the physical resemblance? We've seen Dougie. If Dougie was supposed to be someone who didn't look like Cooper, they would have had another actor play him in the Red Room.

Cooper was acting like himself inside the Lodge, but never outside. That's the key point. The outside world has only seen the "bad" Cooper for the past quarter century. I think this is quite certain given what we have seen so far. The damage he has inflicted upon the world is unknown, but likely to be significant; Annie, Audrey, Diane, nurse with the ring - are all likely victims. The "good" Cooper (in the form of Dougie) has not fully emerged from the Lodge as of this time. BTW... Dougie was a shady character himself before "good" Cooper essentially took over his body. He was a compulsive gambler, spending money on prostitutes while he had a beautiful wife and a son in need of him at home.

[N. Needleman]

Never change, Earle.

[claaa7]

I can only speak for myself in that I do not hate Chrysta Bell at all or really have any opinion on her as a person. It's just that, as a viewer watching her on a tv show, she can't actually act.

I've never had a problem with any of the actors acting in TP1 and TP2 apart from Bellina Logan who I also thought just couldn't act and Kenneth Welsh who actually could act but acted way over the top at times (even though I suspect he was directed to do that so is rather a moot point).

Why would you single out Bellina Logan. I think she had a total of two minutes of screen time? I thought she was funny.

I think the thing with Chrysta Bell is not so much her acting as her persona. Arnold Schwarzenegger is a bad actor, but he has a likable persona so people pay good money to go see his movies. There is something about Chrysta that turns a lot of people off.

Bellina Logan because she stood out very clearly to me as not being able to act. That is how she came across to me in TP only. I've not seen her in anything else though I know she is due to appear in S3 again, unless I've missed her already.

I'm not turned off by Chrysta, all it is is that she can't act.

Luckily there are many accomplished actors in S3 who can which balance everything up.

Bellina Logan did an absolutely amazing job as the Woman With No Name in the last episode of "On The Air".. she was also in "Wild at Heart" but her scenes got cut.

[claaa7]

Josie's best scene was the blackmail head-to-head with Ben, that was the closest to the real Josie we saw. Although, as they speculate after her death, I'm not sure even she knew who the real Josie was at a certain point.

i really like the way Josie was described in the book a lot better than she eventually turned out in the series.. agreed about both the blackmail scene with Ben as well as the Hank Jennings/Josie first meeting in S1. She also did a fine job in the Pilot imo.

[claaa7]

Why would you single out Bellina Logan. I think she had a total of two minutes of screen time? I thought she was funny.

I think the thing with Chrysta Bell is not so much her acting as her persona. Arnold Schwarzenegger is a bad actor, but he has a likable persona so people pay good money to go see his movies. There is something about Chrysta that turns a lot of people off.

Bellina Logan because she stood out very clearly to me as not being able to act. That is how she came across to me in TP only. I've not seen her in anything else though I know she is due to appear in S3 again, unless I've missed her already.

I'm not turned off by Chrysta, all it is is that she can't act.

Luckily there are many accomplished actors in S3 who can which balance everything up.

Bellina Logan did an absolutely amazing job as the Woman With No Name in the last episode of "On The Air".. she was also in "Wild at Heart" but her scenes got cut.

just checked her IMDB turns out she is also in Inland Empire as Linda, can't remember which chcaracter that is though