a twin peaks mystery

Discussion of Twin Peaks TV Series, Fire Walk With Me, and Books

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thegreatnorthern
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a twin peaks mystery

Postby thegreatnorthern » Sun May 29, 2011 2:19 pm

After watching the series for years now, always chronologically
in episode sequence, I have always come to a stopping point
at 2 distinct moments in twin peaks, once at the final episode (29)
(not just for obvious reasons) as to the highly anticipated direction
of the coming storyline, namely cooper's new identity/character
and the future of the other characters - And right after the close
of episode 16 and into 17 - when little by little, the twin peaks world
and associations that have become so familiar and respected, slowly
become replaced with another show temporarily, scene by scene,
the visual effects, the cadence of leland's wake at the haywards,
the essence of the storyarc seems now to rest on the shoulders
of cooper, and his immediate future, both with the fbi and with
a mr. windom earle - and well, you know the rest -
until we conclude with the good "coop" bad "coop" ending~

Just a side note: Although seemingly imperfect alot of the less
desirable episodes of twin peaks do act to heighten the experience
of the rest of them ~ Also I admire the final episode so much, that I
try not to watch it, for a great while, just for maximum red room impact.
Like FWWM, it is difficult not to put my eyes on it often, but it's worth it !

So where could the show have gone ? What could the writers have done ?
I have to wonder, next to laura's life/death as being the most significant,
would coopers life/death be the next highest storyarc available here?
I considered a few other possibilities that might have changed
not just the "ending" of episode 16, but the "ending" after the final episode (29)
It's as if I am being force-fed the windom earle story, when I all I want
to do is savor laura's mystery ~ and continue the investigation to find bob!

This could have led to a less dischorded series ending, and potentially
a continuous narrative/storyarc for the show - a golden circle ;)
So instead of deviating into the mixed storylines post ep.16, let's consider
the exponential outcomes of these possibilities, and please present your own:

*Possibility 1. Another victim is either targeted or taken (fell a victim)
namely donna, audrey, annie perhaps - I found these characters strong enough
that other characters could be colorfully developed around them, but not significant
enough to dominate the storyarc in the way that laura's so eloquently did
This new mystery could be introduced at the very least simply to re-align cooper
on his original intended mission, to find bob - and stop him!
with the support and cast of twin peaks by his side of course ;)

*Possibility 2. While maintaining (testing) the former f.b.i. partner
character in the background (windom), continue exploring the tremont lead,
je une solitaire, something happened there, that needs investigated!
Another mystery (fwwm establishing) that beckons.. and then
who knows- perhaps donna or audrey accidentally discover another piece of laura's
secret life, another video, recorded evidence maybe, found in her bedroom - and on it
is another unexpected and disturbing interference from within this dark town -
A static flash, and then dark nothing, black screen and an electrical surge
just before laura appears with what sounds like a video diary, or confession,
something terrible "bob" made laura do ..or perhaps a crime was recorded ...

Maybe nothing with laura at all is on the video, but a message of some kind, non-decipherable
at first - evidence that falls into the hands of coop, albert and his team, along with major briggs,
and the intuitive sarah palmer, a message, "the message"
buried secret clues that bob is trying to communicate.. to materialize..

"he" is out there..silently waiting - watching
Last edited by thegreatnorthern on Sun May 29, 2011 3:21 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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chesterdesmond
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Re: a twin peaks mystery

Postby chesterdesmond » Sun May 29, 2011 2:44 pm

There is lot's that could've put the show (or films) forward.
like Phillip Jefferies and his connection with Judy (Josie Packard's sister).
Where would the story go with Windom Earle. I never cared for him, and I thought he should've been more menacing.
He just seems like a joke compared to the dark themes in FWWM.
Like you said as well Cooper sticking with his original plans and finally stopping Bob and getting out of the Lodge to stop his evil doppelganger.
There is lots that was left over that could've developed into something.

The thing is if Lynch and Company (not all of them -- not every character could come back) were to come on board, nothing is impossible to
bring the show back to life. You could flip the show around and try to bring some innocence back to what
was once a peaceful town, 25 years later things have changed and with Cooper/Bob out there, I think a lot of damage could've
taken course. I think there are many different possibilities to resurrect this show if they really wanted to go back to it.
And I know Kyle wanted to play Cooper again, and Lynch has made new art for the 20th anniversary of the show, so anything is possible
if a good idea is pitched right to the right people.

But I have no idea what they planned to do for a third season, I rememember reading awhile back that a comicbook was going to be made out of elements for the 3rd season but that never happened.
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Black Rose
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Re: a twin peaks mystery

Postby Black Rose » Tue May 31, 2011 10:21 pm

I think the only thing that could have held down the second season after Leland's death is Cooper/Audrey. So wrong and yet so right...

Also, the more time goes by the more I realize that the problem with the second season is that all the "bad" guys got neutered. For example, Bobby used to be a sketchy, sketchy dude, but he gets turned into a pet in the second season. We want Bad Bobby! And Bad Leo, and Bad Hank, and Bad Ben, and all the other people who made the first season so delicious.
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thegreatnorthern
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Re: a twin peaks mystery

Postby thegreatnorthern » Wed Jun 08, 2011 6:22 pm

Thank you black rose !

I am very interested in hearing what the board has to say on this topic, perhaps there is an existing thread but I would like to see both, where twin peaks could have gone and where it can still go ..

Please add your ideas here and express your opinions on twin peaks future ~
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peaked&confused
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Re: a twin peaks mystery

Postby peaked&confused » Mon Jun 13, 2011 4:09 pm

25 Years Later ?

I have to warn you: a lot of obvious clichés can be found below.

<< Sheriff Andy Brennan investigates a missing child case involving one of his younger son's classmates. The disappearance occurred the previous day, during a school picnic outing near Owl Cave. A morning search party is organised, including one or two familiar faces. With the help of his natural clumsiness, Andy stumbles on a mysterious section of the cave where the boy is found relatively unscathed. All ends well, except that same night, Andy dreams of owls and other mysticism-related elements. Waking up from this apparent nightmare, he exits the room without disturbing Lucy's peaceful sleep, and gets himself a glass of water in the kitchen area, seeing his own reflection in the window pane in front of him. As he walks away, from the corner of his eye, he definitively notices a dark silhouette outside, the window giving away on an outside patio deck. Flicking on the light switch to the outdoor porch, he notices only empty space before him. Carefully moving outside to investigate closer, he grabs a MagLite flashlight to use as an improvised weapon (discreet product endorsements are always welcome when financing pilot episodes!!). "Hello, anybody there ? Hello !". Obviously, nobody is there, but the occasion is good to reintroduce some iconic elements at this point (i.e. windswept Douglas Firs, lit by the circular flashlight beam, an ominous Badalamenti score raising the tension level, etc...). Just as he's about to head back inside, a bit spooked by the eerie night air, the porch light goes bonkers and blows up in it's socket. As he's heading back inside, he hears a voice behind him, "Andy! I need your help Andy. There isn't much time.". Turning around in a sudden movement, stumbling over folded patio chairs, Andy is startled by the apparition of Agent Dale Cooper, basking in a strange bluish-tainted beam of light, hovering a couple of feet above the wooden surface. >>


A couple of other possible plot developments ?

a) Agent Desmond (Chris Isaak) "materializes" next to the same FWWM trailer camper (I always thought this camper to be the White Lodge), in a long abandoned drive-in park, set in some dust filled Utah desert locale. He walks aimlessly for several hours but the journey will leave him suffering from a severe heat stroke upon reaching civilization, causing him to collapse into a "3-episode" coma. Luckily, his ID papers will help the authorities in contacting FBI's Albert Rosenfield, and recently retired Gordon Cole.

b) Harry Truman lives as a recluse, in the same manner as the Log Lady. Now making a modest living as a (hunting game warden?), we eventually learn about the source of his isolation: 20 years ago, he was forced to kill Bob aka Dale Cooper during an intense man hunt, at the foot of Glastonbury Grove, thus preventing Annie Blackburn's imminent death at the hands of the killer (after all, we can't have Bob living thru fake Dale for all of these years without raising suspicion, now can we ? ). Andy and a couple of the Bookhouse Boys will pay a visit to him, informing him of the latest Dale apparition.

Personally, unless some very good meditation-induced ideas from DL are brought forth, I would prefer the original series to remain as it stands.
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Re: a twin peaks mystery

Postby my socks are on fire » Tue Jun 14, 2011 4:00 pm

I think the issues - for lack of a better word - of TP's sustainablity were mainly character related.

For me, the only character that rang true was Laura herself - the majority of everyone else was introduced as a suspect in her murder. Outside of them, Cooper was the only viable outlet to any other storyline. The only out I could think of would be along the lines of BV, where we see Jeffrey starting to come unraveled (and more believable) in his pursuits of crime solving.

TP sorta ended up there, albeit with at best non-believable - and sometimes plain silly - narrative in the second season. But once we got the fractured cooper in the black lodge confronting his demons, we kinda saw where the show should have gone. The Black Lodge concept seemed completely bogus until that last episode, where it tied back to Cooper's vision and very literally introduced the 'other side' to his character.

In contrast, FWWM is all about that original true character - the one that suffers rather than plots, the one who's secrets are the source of her dispair rather than making her look suspicious. We know how it's going to end, but we watch anyway because we care about her (at least I did).

While DL's world certainly resides in the surreal at times, there's something about it that seems 'truer' to me than the continuing narrative-approach of television. It was a great mix for a while, but I don't think it's really sustainable. That's why I think MD the movie probably turned out 100 times better than MD the TV series would have.
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thegreatnorthern
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Re: a twin peaks mystery

Postby thegreatnorthern » Sun Jun 19, 2011 10:47 am

Well said ~ my socks
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Audrey Horne
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Re: a twin peaks mystery

Postby Audrey Horne » Sun Jun 19, 2011 1:10 pm

I always saw it as the opposite. That Laura wasn't a character but merely a vechicle. She was a very seductive plot device to open a window into watching characters in a very clever soap opera.

I loved the first season when it was going over the top with making Laura involved with practically every little thing in town. It was absurd and kind of poking fun of murder mysteries. Laura tutored, taught English lessons, ran meals on wheels, worked one-eyed jacks, etc etc etc etc. It only existed as a means to how it affected that suspect/character she was involved with. Laura only existed by how if affected that character. She in effect becomes a missing puzzle piece to each and every person's life. She represents something different for each character. She can be the sickly sweet memory James has in episode 1 by the well, or she can be the whore to Jacques/Leo, she can be the daughter/lover to Ben.

That's why I was so surprised when FWWM was announced as a prequel following Laura. I guess Lynch fell under the same spell some of the characters did... which is kind of interesting and funny. But while watching that movie (depsite how well made it is) I was just confused why we needed any of it- it seemed stronger to keep it from the point of view of the suspects than the actual victim. Better to keep it in the imagination.

I thought there was a very strong cast to keep a show going, a very, very strong cast at the core. Before it got off track and rushed. But I could watch stories about Cooper, Audrey and Catherine all day. Then you had Bobby, Ben and Pete as strong support. And all the minor characters as great color. I just thought the strengh of the show was the playing with the conventional soap elements and then lacing and injecting moments of true honest emotions was so exhilerating (Audrey crying while watching Leland dance comes to mind).

I think the problem was just that moment in time and how TV worked. The cast is just as strong as The Sopranos or Mad Men. It's just when it came out and how it had to keep it up at that rate. If it had the luxury of plotting out its entire season at its leisure, it would have been just fine.
God, I love this music. Isn't it too dreamy?
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thegreatnorthern
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Re: a twin peaks mystery

Postby thegreatnorthern » Sun Jun 19, 2011 2:05 pm

Interesting Audrey - considering the idea that laura palmer can be defined within the context of relative characters, and considering viewing twin peaks within the context of the original air dates - And over time I have seen how this story offers alot of relativistic enjoyment for those who know how to look for it. This is such a rare quality and hard to find ..
Twin peaks works on SO many levels

Seeing twin peaks from laura's eyes finally I think does offer a unique insight, a pov, otherwise made unavailable by the show and thus further advances the viewers psychological/emotional exploration into this world. To me fwwm is as perfect as dl intended it to be. It is clear that david lynch continued his passion for twin peaks throughout fwwm, I can fully appreciate the work of art that is fwwm, because without it, twin peaks would truly be incomplete.
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Audrey Horne
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Re: a twin peaks mystery

Postby Audrey Horne » Sun Jun 19, 2011 5:47 pm

definitely can see that, and I'm not saying my opinion is more valid than another's.

Lynch and Frost originally invisioned this show to be about a town, and the murder was merely a catalyst to launch it. But like any ongoing piece of work or art (or work of art) things change, and original thought or idea can turn into something very different.
God, I love this music. Isn't it too dreamy?
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forgiveness
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Re: a twin peaks mystery

Postby forgiveness » Mon Jun 20, 2011 2:21 pm

To me, the series ended where it ended and I'm not sure that I ever want it to continue in a physical, you can watch it on tv or pop it into your dvd player, kind of way. It continues on in dreams, the same dreams that the series was so steeped in. Do I believe that in his hearts of hearts Lynch expected there would be another series? No.

To return there in any concrete way breaks the circle.

The whole of Twin Peaks was an ouroborus. It was the dragon eating its tail only to begin again. It was the story learned and taught to a seemingly strong detective, Dale Cooper. The story of a girl, Laura Palmer, everyone thought was happy but was tormented by a supernatural force that had fallen in love with her, or as close to love as BOB could ever come, as mostly everyone else had done. And while hearing Laura's story, Cooper slowly found himself in the fate that Laura had willingly died to avoid and that his own darker nature had been repressed to the point that it aided in his downfall. This fate was a necessary one even if it isn't pleasant. You can see the signs of it even dating back to the alternate ending Lynch did for the Pilot.

FWWM makes sense to return to Laura because it was Laura the whole series began with and she was the heart of Twin Peaks to David Lynch. As the Log Lady said "Laura is the one". She was the host that BOB really wanted and would be willing to risk everything for and in strange twist of fate, with Dale in the Red Room where time doesn't matter, he did get a second chance. I will always believe that it is the fulfilment of that strange poem. It takes us through the darkness of future past. When Cooper tells Laura not to take the ring the whole series is put in jeopardy. If Laura became host to BOB Dale would not come to Twin Peaks. We never would have been introduced to any of the characters we fell in love with. However, when Laura still senses taking the ring is the right thing to do, everything is returned to the way it was and the circle is completed.

I will forever be grateful to David Lynch for his take on the world of Twin Peaks.
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Re: a twin peaks mystery

Postby my socks are on fire » Mon Jun 20, 2011 11:52 pm

I love this thread.

As soon as I shot off my reply, I wondered if anyone would call BS on it. I try to distill things down to a too-convenient solution within my frame of reference.

While I still think DL thought that Laura and Dale were the main characters (or at least he ended up thinking that way), it's short-sighted for me to dismiss everyone else and the writing behind them. Some of that comes from hindsight, as well as my own Waldo Lydecker/Scotty Ferguson tendencies.

The mysterious girl always gets my attention (is it a guy thing?), and I want to see things through that lens. The secret diary made a big impact on me, and I spent the rest of the series/movie reconciling what was happening with Laura's perspective. The truth is that without Audrey in season one that the story could've ground to a halt, as she took the mantle of detective while Dale was reveling in oddball land and became someone we cared about - it drove me crazy when Cooper didn't see her note! Ben and Leo held my attention until 'the reveal', but I really didn't care about Bobby (and dare I say James) until FWWM when they got rounded out by Laura's presence. Shelly - think my screen name sums that up.

I'm going to read through all the 'lets talk changes' threads to inform myself further. Thanks everyone - keep posting.

PS: Audrey, funny you should mention that moment (my desktop)...
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thegreatnorthern
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Re: a twin peaks mystery

Postby thegreatnorthern » Fri Dec 16, 2011 12:00 am

Will soon start watching the series from the very beginning soon ~
always focusing my attention back to the world of twin peaks like a cycle
and usually by the end of feb (24) I prepare for fwwm.
You can leave the town of twin peaks but it never truly leaves you

Noticed that watching all episodes in sequential order
and cyclically has been far richer for me than randomly,
There is a kind of coincidental order, flow, or magic
that is preserved when a kind of respect is extended
and a memory is preserved. A kind of reflection
A true artform, hard to imagine this was actually
on tv ! It's like a bright light and you are in the middle
of it, just like james described to maddy,
all dewy eyed by the lake.

When I am not watching the show, and working like everyone else,
I can sense and feel the presence of it, like I am in a waiting room, without color,
but with quiet anticipation, and always with laura in the back of my mind.
With dream-like whispers in my ear
looks something like this visual interpretation ~

A strange familiar~
Image


When it is time again to re-enter the world of twin peaks
I feel like I am in a "plural realm"
Image
mlsstwrt
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Re: a twin peaks mystery

Postby mlsstwrt » Wed Feb 01, 2012 10:20 pm

I'm a bit late coming to this thread but better late than never.

The comment I really wanted to make was in relation to what Audrey said, that Laura functioned effectively as a plot device to introduce us to other characters and stories. It's an interesting interpretation and of course it may have served that purpose too but like some of the other posters I feel strongly that Laura is the heart of Twin Peaks. I know from some of your other posts you're not overly fond of Laura. I feel differently and I think Lynch said in an interview somewhere that he was in love with Laura.

As for the point about Laura having so many different personalities and being different things for different people, I always say this as being of integral importance to the character. I found this aspect of Laura, which came out in the series, in the diary and then most vividy in FWWM, as being utterly fascinating. She was this person, doing her best to hold it together on the outside and fulfil the roles that were expected of someone beautiful, good, intelligent and popular. That's manifested by her being the sweet girlfriend to James, the Prom Queen, running the Meals and Wheels programem. Then there is the whole dark side of her nature which in turn results her working as a prostitute, whore to Leo/Jacques, involvement in drugs, etc. For me it never seemed to be a contrivance - on the contrary, she was a living breathing character subject to many conflicting impulses and desires, not two dimensional in the least.

So in my view it was absolutely the right thing to do to go back in time for the movie, rather than to go forward as (I think) Mark Frost wanted to do, to breathe life into the character whose life had shaped the entire first season of the Series and to witness the terrible but somehow beautiful crucifixion of this young girl.

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