Twin Peaks Return: The Profoundly Disappointed Support Group

[Panapaok]

I love the show so far but I can definitely understand why many don't. After all, one man's trash is another man's treasure. What I don't understand is the baffling criticism of the visual look as 'amateurish'. Yeah it's digital but it looks stunning. Lynch/Deming is a very strong visual duo.

[douglasb]

In which case, it's a bad TV show. You should be able to watch it; study is an option.

No.

+1

Also, I do recommend people rewatch (if they feel up to it), because there's so much being discovered in these, the episodes are brimming with narrative, with character, with plot, etc. It's a smorgasbord!

Wrong thread.

[Jonah]

Certainly nothing about the show is revolutionary, nothing is striking or original. The show just coasts. An initial viewing of each episode is just trying to get through it. Nothing has moved me, very little has intrigued me, even on a second viewing. Anything that has been intriguing hasn't been followed up on, in favor of introducing still more characters, more locations that we don't even know or care about

This is pretty much exactly how I've felt. Apart from a few scenes here and there that I liked. I do think a rewatch might help. I haven't rewatched it properly yet. I do think it will get better and the narrative will pick up. But so far, it's been a bit of a slog to get through. And I agree that it hasn't been particularly moving or intriguing. (I'm still WANTING to fall in love with it-or like it, and a few times I did think I was beginning to warm to it.)

[Agent Earle]

You have to study this show, you can't just watch it.

In which case, it's a bad TV show. You should be able to watch it; study is an option.

Yes. Case in point: The Wire.

[oldforce]

No.

+1

Also, I do recommend people rewatch (if they feel up to it), because there's so much being discovered in these, the episodes are brimming with narrative, with character, with plot, etc. It's a smorgasbord!

Wrong thread.

correct thread.

[LateReg]

Certainly nothing about the show is revolutionary, nothing is striking or original. The show just coasts. An initial viewing of each episode is just trying to get through it. Nothing has moved me, very little has intrigued me, even on a second viewing. Anything that has been intriguing hasn't been followed up on, in favor of introducing still more characters, more locations that we don't even know or care about

This is pretty much exactly how I've felt. Apart from a few scenes here and there that I liked. I do think a rewatch might help. I haven't rewatched it properly yet. I do think it will get better and the narrative will pick up. But so far, it's been a bit of a slog to get through. And I agree that it hasn't been particularly moving or intriguing. (I'm still WANTING to fall in love with it-or like it, and a few times I did think I was beginning to warm to it.)

This is directed more toward IcedOver's original comment rather than you, Jonah, but I really feel like everything about this show is revolutionary, striking and original. From the pacing to the structure to the way it truly feels like a non-episodic 18-hour film to the bursts of genuine surreality to the way it tackles the passing of time to its utter lack of nostalgia...I haven't ever seen anything like it on TV. I've been revisiting certain classic shows lately, and they all seem very straightforward because of The Return. That has nothing to do with my perceptions of The Return's quality, by the way, just the way it has been brought to the screen. I'm not looking to change anyone's mind, but I wanted to respond because that comment just struck me as the opposite of how I feel.

[N. Needleman]

No, it's not the correct thread to lecture other people on how to watch and what they should be doing, anymore than it was previously the correct thread to suggest the rest of us are clueless Kool-Aid drinking dupes or Nazi sympathizers.

Let people feel how they want to feel. No one needs to play Mormon missionary.

[Gabriel]

Do you watched distractedly or with focus?

No such distinction exists. You either watch something or you don't watch something. If you glance up at an episode while writing on the Dugpa forum, you're not paying attention to the programme, therefore you're not really watching it.

[Gabriel]

...anymore than it was previously the correct thread to suggest the rest of us are clueless Kool-Aid drinking dupes or Nazi sympathizers...

... or giraffe f***ers!!

[Metamorphia]

So are those planning on giving up if episode 7 isn't up to par going to stick around on the forums moaning?

[Twink Peaks]

It is not happening again

[sylvia_north]

I encourage everyone to dig deeper, to rewatch episodes and to take notes.
You have to study this show, you can't just watch it.

I'll echo an above sentiment for people who are very disappointed to give each episode a second watch. .

anyway, i urge everyone who doesn't like it to give each part a second watch. moments that made me uncomfortable or were frustrating on the first watch became much more enjoyable on the second viewing

Some of us are, don't assume we aren't!! I just read someone else said they were watching them "countless times." I watched them all consecutively daily up until 6, which the more I watch 6 (I'm on 5x,) the more pointless it gets. Because of my lifelong passion for Twin Peaks and David Lynch, I feel like I've both been harder on Return and more forgiving than it perhaps is owed.

My problem lies on a more shallow level, though. I'm happy to read about people finding meanings in it (which I clearly fail to do) but it doesn't help the simple fact that the scenes that you have mentioned just don't appeal to me. "Meaningful but boring" gives more hope for he future than "meaningless and boring", still...

Right. The only merit I'm finding is in the puzzling old mysteries in the context of the new world. As with IE, though, it's more of an obligation/chore than a pleasure.

Now anytime I try to air my disappointments in the main episode threads, I'm being told it's just because I miss the old show and the characters (which is true in part, but not my major reason for not loving the new series) or have been flat out called "impatient and reactionary". So I can see why people are starting to gravitate to this thread. It's a shame though. It seems like you have to post here if you're disappointed - and then it's called the "bash thread". But in truth I'd rather post on the main boards on an episode by episode basis and will continue to do so. We should all be able to discuss our individual feelings about each episode, and the series overall, without being grouped into "loving it" or "disappointed".

It's not that I hate the new series, I just find I'm not enjoying it. And I find I'm really wanting to like it more than I do. But I just find it mostly cold and boring. And very repetitive and dull. For example, in Episode 6, there was only one all too brief moment that got me excited (Diane) and another (Hawk finding the pages) that I thought was pretty good. The rest just felt alienating and dull. All that stuff with the goons and Vegas is just so dull, the silly little hitman, ugh, and the over the top absurd comedy of Dougie/Janey-E only partially works. I don't think that's impatience. If the material isn't working for someone, it isn't working for them. And it's not just that I miss the town and the characters because frankly a lot of those scenes - in the town - feel off to me too.

I don't know, I'll probably stick with it. But I enjoy talking about it on here more than I actually enjoy watching it. It definitely does feel more like "Mulholland Drive - The TV Series". I don't necessarily want it to be cozy or to revisit old ground, but I would like it to be set in the town and follow characters from "Twin Peaks". That much is true. But beyond that there's a lot that just isn't working for me in the new series - it feels disconnected and badly structured.

Above all, I'm sure it is leading somewhere, and I do think it will get better. But that's not the point. This isn't about impatience. It's about not really enjoying the individual episodes or "parts" to date.

You are in good company here. I dont' know how many times we have to reiterate that this thread is not whining not about things not being the same. And I don't think there's anything irrational or wrongheaded about approaching Return from *gasp* wanting to be entertained.

Edited to add - Just want to say I respect everyone's views whether they love it, hate it, or are inbetween. I don't get why everyone has to argue with each other about it. I enjoy reading people's thoughts, even those I don't agree with. I think everyone should be able to say they love it, hate it, or are mixed, without people judging them and analysing "WHY" they feel the way they do. People have outright told me (in the most recent Episode 6 thread) "you feel that way because you just want the old show back", "you're bordering on impatient and reactionary". I mean, come on. Let everyone have their view without psychoanalysis.

Absolutely. And it's more productive discussing the 'why's' of both camps with likeminded people for obvious reasons. No one who's gushing is going to come anywhere close to eye-to-eye with someone who wants to destroy their TV set. It's just picking a fight if you're come to the "contrarian" thread and condescendingly call people "triggered" (I promise no one is having trauma-related flashbacks.

I don't know why the hit-and-run scene didn't have any emotional impact on me. Family and friends say it was strong.

None here either. Heard about this scene from those who watching the filming so I knew what was coming, but we're got mother of the year playing tag in an intersection, and that stupid floating soul effect.

Having watched the first 5 episodes countless times by now, I do think Lynch and Frost will bring the melodrama back by the end of the series. The first couple of songs we hear in the Roadhouse suggest that the tone is dark and flat for narrative reasons. It's because this is a world without Cooper. But as he returns, I think that old style will return more as well.

But to be totally honest, I'm glad the melodrama isn't as cheesy and overwhelming as it was in 1990. I don't even show the old episodes to my creative writing students because it just comes off so thickly sentimental.

Maybe by the end of the Return there will be a nice mix of tones. But I personally enjoy the way things are now. They're simply the tone many avant garde works adopt in order to estrange the viewer.

For sure! This is why I don't try to convert people to fans anymore. A lot of it plays as cornball and TV has become a hell of a lot more cynical. I like the new tone just fine, but it's largely not a compelling overall picture.

Now, arguments as to whether Lynch's metaphors are ham-fisted is a whole other thing. I'm finding a lot of grace in the story of Cooper's battered, vulnerable essence entering the world as an infant. I'm moved by the idea that a grand soul like Dale Cooper's succumbing to darkness would inexorably infect the whole world with a kind of unnamable dis-ease, and I find that idea totally consistent with the world-view and abstract logic of Twin Peaks as a whole.

I agree that it has merit and it perfectly meets my expectations, along with Mr C, about Cooper's fate out of the lodge, but it's become tedious and plodding.

[Gabriel]

So are those planning on giving up if episode 7 isn't up to par going to stick around on the forums moaning?

Rather than sneering, try reading.

I said the following.

So I think it's fair to say after a third of the episodes that I've given it a go. I'm not going to sit around the boards bitching about the new show for another three months if some people are getting something out of the experience. I have no desire to spoil the experience for them.

Need I say more?

Oh and a big to you too, cupcake!

[Metamorphia]

Wasn't strictly referring to you "cupcake"! I've seen it mentioned across the boards as early as from episodes 1 and 2, including comments on reddit!

But good for you.

[boske]

I have seen episodes 1-5 thrice and episode 6 twice. I hope to see episodes 7 to 9, and will then reassess.

So many things to do not make sense. What is the real point of conversation with Denise and the phone conversation with Albert, mentioning drinking bourbon in female company? I fail to see a tangible meaning, how does it really serve the story? Are we back to `Cole kissing Shelly` type of scene here? Is that really art? What about the NYC investigation (Sam and Tracy murder)? Pay attention to Cole's lips when he initially sees the crime scene photo from the NYC building, just before he utters "what the hell", it is also a subtle sign. Cole is not what he seems either.